direct your attention to the San Remo Manual on International Law Applicable to Armed Conflicts at Sea. Specifically, paragraph 67-68:
Merchant vessels flying the flag of neutral States may not be attacked unless they:
(a) are believed on reasonable grounds to be carrying contraband or breaching a blockade , and after prior warning they intentionally and clearly refuse to stop, or intentionally and clearly resist visit, search or capture;
(b) engage in belligerent acts on behalf of the enemy;<
(c) act as auxiliaries to the enemy s armed forces;
(d) are incorporated into or assist the enemy s intelligence system;
(e) sail under convoy of enemy warships or military aircraft; or
(f) otherwise make an effective contribution to the enemy s military action, e.g., by carrying military materials, and it is not feasible for the attacking forces to first place passengers and crew in a place of safety. Unless circumstances do not permit, they are to be given a warning, so that they can re-route, off-load, or take other precautions.
To fight and conquer in all your battles is not supreme excellence; supreme excellence consists in breaking the enemy’s resistance without fighting.
-Sun Tzu, the Art of War
The Zionists just fear Arabs may be doing the same thing THEY did, when they returned to the area after what was a basic absence for nearly 2,000 years. (YES, a minority of Jewish folks did remain behind. Compare the “freedom” of Jews under most of the Muslim occupancy of Europe, vs their treatment by “good Christians”.)
This argument always goes back to the basic question: Did the United Nations have the right to create the state of Israel out of an already existing state? Did the people who had been there for a very long time lose their right to their state because the United Nations told them it was more important for the world that the state of Israel exist?
I always wonder how we can discuss this without at the very least taking into consideration the people who were there before 1948 (and yes, I know the region’s political situation was tremendously complex long before that).
On June 8, 1967, US Navy intelligence ship USS Liberty was suddenly and brutally attacked on the high seas in international waters by the air and naval forces of Israel. The Israeli forces attacked with full knowledge that this was an American ship and lied about it. Survivors have been forbidden for 40 years to tell their story under oath to the American public. The USS Liberty Memorial web site tells their story and is dedicated to the memory of the 34 brave men who died.
The worst blow to prospect of peace in the area was the loss of Rabin. BB, who came after, did everything he could to destroy the peace process while Arafat was making a significant effort to get it to work.
The longer Arafat made concessions to Israel without getting anything in return, the more he needed in a final deal to bring to his people. BB essentially took and took, driving Arafat’s position to untenable which is probably what BB was after.
Even Sharon came to the conclusion that a 2-state solution was necessary but BB will never allow that to happen.
Arafat was a corrupt old bastard but at least he did give the peace process a try.
“Even Sharon” is very significant, because he was NOT A NICE GUY, but even HE recognized the only path to peace, which Netanyahu and his backers (as in AIPAC) want no part of. Exactly what is the REAL story behind Sharon’s “stroke”??
“The Sword and the Star” is something on the order of the title of a book on the history of the IDF- going back to the end of the 19th century, written by a Jewish author, and very detailed in the “reality” of the Zionist movement in Palestine. Leon Uris wrote “Exodus” and stirred up a lot of sympathy for Israel and Zionists- but glossed over more than a few facts in his fiction.
Sometimes it seems the only answer isn’t political, but geological. If everything west from the Dead Sea up the Jordan would slide into the Med, and disappear beneath the waters, like old Alexandria, the solution might finally arrive?
Cain and Abel are alive and well. Well, still trying to kill each other.
^ Thanks, fennec, for this very interesting link. As I have said here and there from time to time, I am a strong supporter of the right of Israel to exist within secure borders, and I am suspicious that some (by no means all) of the criticism of Israel has a hint of anti-Semitism about it. But I also do not believe that Israel should get a blank cheque to do whatever it wants. The settlement policy, I believe, demonstrates that those who currently make policy in Israel have no serious interest in a reasonable solution to this problem. I think the blockade may well be legal, but it has to be understood as part of a larger picture.
I do not intend any of this to suggest that the Palestinians and the Arab countries should not be criticized as well, and in some ways their policies have been no better and sometimes worse than Israeli policy. But the US is not bankrolling the Palestinians.
shortass- I assume you consider Russia “gave back” East Germany?– exactly the same return of sovereign territory that Israel “gave back” in Lebanon, which they haven’t, and Gaza, which they haven’t, in reality.
cdward said, 2 days ago
”This argument always goes back to the basic question:”
I once thought all Palestinians were no more than terrorists. It was after asking those very same questions you pose in your post that I began changing my view (that and being exposed to a more critical press outside South Africa once I left it in ‘87).
gslusher almost 14 years ago
This seems to forget that many Palestinian Arabs are Semites, as well.
SuperGriz almost 14 years ago
Arabs are a Semitic people. Arabic is a Semitic language. Family feuds are the worst.
Thomas R. Williams almost 14 years ago
Family feuds are the worst.
Just ask the Celts.
Motivemagus almost 14 years ago
^I’m with you on that, billdog.
twieliczka almost 14 years ago
I’m flagging those spammers but is GoComics doing anything about it?
jster51 almost 14 years ago
They must be: 9:05 pdt and no spammers here!
oneoldhat almost 14 years ago
direct your attention to the San Remo Manual on International Law Applicable to Armed Conflicts at Sea. Specifically, paragraph 67-68:
Merchant vessels flying the flag of neutral States may not be attacked unless they: (a) are believed on reasonable grounds to be carrying contraband or breaching a blockade , and after prior warning they intentionally and clearly refuse to stop, or intentionally and clearly resist visit, search or capture; (b) engage in belligerent acts on behalf of the enemy;< (c) act as auxiliaries to the enemy s armed forces; (d) are incorporated into or assist the enemy s intelligence system; (e) sail under convoy of enemy warships or military aircraft; or (f) otherwise make an effective contribution to the enemy s military action, e.g., by carrying military materials, and it is not feasible for the attacking forces to first place passengers and crew in a place of safety. Unless circumstances do not permit, they are to be given a warning, so that they can re-route, off-load, or take other precautions.
cfimeiatpap almost 14 years ago
To fight and conquer in all your battles is not supreme excellence; supreme excellence consists in breaking the enemy’s resistance without fighting. -Sun Tzu, the Art of War
WarBush almost 14 years ago
Playing the (ethnic) card, I see.
Dtroutma almost 14 years ago
The Zionists just fear Arabs may be doing the same thing THEY did, when they returned to the area after what was a basic absence for nearly 2,000 years. (YES, a minority of Jewish folks did remain behind. Compare the “freedom” of Jews under most of the Muslim occupancy of Europe, vs their treatment by “good Christians”.)
cdward almost 14 years ago
This argument always goes back to the basic question: Did the United Nations have the right to create the state of Israel out of an already existing state? Did the people who had been there for a very long time lose their right to their state because the United Nations told them it was more important for the world that the state of Israel exist?
I always wonder how we can discuss this without at the very least taking into consideration the people who were there before 1948 (and yes, I know the region’s political situation was tremendously complex long before that).
SuperGriz almost 14 years ago
No, but they should <——- sarcasm…
SuperGriz almost 14 years ago
http://www.gtr5.com/
On June 8, 1967, US Navy intelligence ship USS Liberty was suddenly and brutally attacked on the high seas in international waters by the air and naval forces of Israel. The Israeli forces attacked with full knowledge that this was an American ship and lied about it. Survivors have been forbidden for 40 years to tell their story under oath to the American public. The USS Liberty Memorial web site tells their story and is dedicated to the memory of the 34 brave men who died.
meetinthemiddle almost 14 years ago
The worst blow to prospect of peace in the area was the loss of Rabin. BB, who came after, did everything he could to destroy the peace process while Arafat was making a significant effort to get it to work.
The longer Arafat made concessions to Israel without getting anything in return, the more he needed in a final deal to bring to his people. BB essentially took and took, driving Arafat’s position to untenable which is probably what BB was after.
Even Sharon came to the conclusion that a 2-state solution was necessary but BB will never allow that to happen.
Arafat was a corrupt old bastard but at least he did give the peace process a try.
Dtroutma almost 14 years ago
“Even Sharon” is very significant, because he was NOT A NICE GUY, but even HE recognized the only path to peace, which Netanyahu and his backers (as in AIPAC) want no part of. Exactly what is the REAL story behind Sharon’s “stroke”??
“The Sword and the Star” is something on the order of the title of a book on the history of the IDF- going back to the end of the 19th century, written by a Jewish author, and very detailed in the “reality” of the Zionist movement in Palestine. Leon Uris wrote “Exodus” and stirred up a lot of sympathy for Israel and Zionists- but glossed over more than a few facts in his fiction.
Sometimes it seems the only answer isn’t political, but geological. If everything west from the Dead Sea up the Jordan would slide into the Med, and disappear beneath the waters, like old Alexandria, the solution might finally arrive?
Cain and Abel are alive and well. Well, still trying to kill each other.
lonecat almost 14 years ago
^ Thanks, fennec, for this very interesting link. As I have said here and there from time to time, I am a strong supporter of the right of Israel to exist within secure borders, and I am suspicious that some (by no means all) of the criticism of Israel has a hint of anti-Semitism about it. But I also do not believe that Israel should get a blank cheque to do whatever it wants. The settlement policy, I believe, demonstrates that those who currently make policy in Israel have no serious interest in a reasonable solution to this problem. I think the blockade may well be legal, but it has to be understood as part of a larger picture.
I do not intend any of this to suggest that the Palestinians and the Arab countries should not be criticized as well, and in some ways their policies have been no better and sometimes worse than Israeli policy. But the US is not bankrolling the Palestinians.
Palestino almost 14 years ago
Great toon by the greatest toonist of Gocomics..
How can an honest person be neutral when a crime is committed in front of millions on live broadcast..?
Dtroutma almost 14 years ago
shortass- I assume you consider Russia “gave back” East Germany?– exactly the same return of sovereign territory that Israel “gave back” in Lebanon, which they haven’t, and Gaza, which they haven’t, in reality.
pbarnrob almost 14 years ago
Just flagged chuimsa, and visited several places they commented! They don’t learn, do they?
AVOID ‘jordan1’ (the multiurl redirection is broken; ‘502 Bad Gateway’)
Take the ‘Boulder Pledge’ – don’t do ANY business with spammers, EVER!
riley05 almost 14 years ago
Or go one step further.
Email them, and tell them you don’t do ANY business with spammers.
In my private fantasy world, that makes a difference.
SuperGriz almost 14 years ago
Oh, what’s a few hydrogen bombs among friends?
OmqR-IV.0 almost 14 years ago
cdward said, 2 days ago ”This argument always goes back to the basic question:” I once thought all Palestinians were no more than terrorists. It was after asking those very same questions you pose in your post that I began changing my view (that and being exposed to a more critical press outside South Africa once I left it in ‘87).