And if your hero George W Bush had not invaded Iraq, ISIS never would have come into existence in the first place!GWBush- the gift that keeps on giving!
WoW!! Your disconnect from reality is absolutely stunning. A week of bombing? Really? And complaining about golfing is totally ironic in light of the past administration’s performance.
ISIS has attacked Iran border guards, and continues to battle Iran’s ally Bashir Assad. ISIS is getting funded by people inside the borders of our “friend and ally” Saudi Arabia. ISIS is the enemy of Hezbollah. When we attack ISIS we once again help Iran and its allies. Complicated isn’t it? Ah, well, Churchill helped Stalin fight Hitler. If Stalin and Churchill could be allies … We want to help the “good guys” but we’re having a hard time finding any in the southwestern Asia. The Kurds, I guess. Jordan, and (comparatively) Turkey and Israel. And some smaller groups here and there. If we could just get ourselves out from between Shiites and the Sunnis! And stop pretending this is ALL ABOUT US. We’re about as welcome there as the police are in the middle of a gang war.
Yes, we have to stop using gunboat diplomacy to control the rest of the world. Hopefully one day the human race will advance enough to solve problems cooperatively instead of fighting wars and killing off a few hundred thousand people.
re.“^ umm, … Anyways, if once again, B Hussein Obama wasn’t golfing and fundraising for the past year, we would’ve wiped out ISIS in a week of bombing. ……”
One might consider that wiping “out ISIS in a week of bombing” would obviously be impossible. Unless one were willing to consider, say, nuclear carpet – bombing of Iraq and Syria, and make a dead zone of, say, another 100 miles in all directions around Iraq and Syria.
But, for almost all of us, this would be too horrible to contemplate.
And when the Syrian civil war first broke out, what exactly, were you and the rest of the Tea-Party R’s saying Obama SHOULD have done about it, hmmmm?Let’s hear it, I’m waiting
David Ignatius and Fareed Zakeria (it bears repeating on this ‘toon as well) both have excellent columns today on the fact that it is the need for a coalition, NOT the U.S. going alone that Obama’s working on, and that’s vital to halt this ARAB ON ARAB problem, which is NOT a “Muslim” problem,as these groups opposed ARAB dictatorships long supported by the west. Zakaria points to the hundreds of millions of Muslims around the world, notably India and Indonesia (the largest Muslim population) who do NOT support ISIS, Al Qaeda, Taliban, or other radical nominative “Muslim” groups who routinely violate the scripture in the Quran, but spouting “crud” from latter day nut case “clerics”.
I may be speaking out of turn here but I can assure you, martens does not condone capital punishment of any type.martens said; “but such ritual killing is still the mark of an uncivilized people.”Read that again and examine who Martens includes with that criticism; it isn’t just Saudi Arabia.
Surely by now you must know where posters like martens stand on these points?
Nice troll work. This is a regional; conflict, not one state attacking another. There are many factions in the fight; The Syrian government, and a few miscellaneous Syrian groups, Hezbollah, Kurds, Iranians and Al Qaeda, just to name a few.. it’s all complicated by the internal conflicts (Sunni and Shia for example) Blaming Bush or Obama completely misses the point. It’s our overly simplistic Mideast “policy” which for decades has consistently identified an individual actor (Iraq, Afghanistan, etc.) as the enemy. Of course the root of it all is the imperialists in Europe (British, French, Dutch et al) who took it upon themselves to jigger the borders and create new countries. Carpet bombing is a great bumper sticker strategy but just more of the same. Shock and awe anyone?
Please explain what defines the difference, in your world, between “moderate conservative” “moderate liberal” “liberal” and “ultra-liberal”. I’m guessing that they all amount to the same thing, as far you’re concerned: left of yourself. For that matter, what is the difference, in your view, between conservative and ultra-conservative? And then what would define, again for you, someone whose opinions are to the right of you? There are lots of people to the left of me, but who is to the right of you? And how would you distinguish between conservative and regressive? I think of a conservative as one who wants to conserve or preserve things that exist, while a regressive want go back and resurrect things that are gone (usually things that never existed at all). So tell us where you stand, rather than just throw rocks at everyone to the left of you.
Well, you know what they say, “I don’t express my opinion in the hope of changing anyone’s mind. I express my opinion so that others who think in a similar manner will not feel alone.” There do seem to be a certain set of people (left and right) who are so full of self-righteousness that they never give a moments thought to anything, however moderate or reasonable, with which they do not already agree. But worse, some of them seem to actually want to antagonize, insult, and bully others. They want to call them names, impugn their intelligence and their morals. They want a fight. I always imagine them to be people who impotent and humiliated in their real lives, playing out their combative fantasies behind the mask of anonymity that is the internet. And if it is so, perhaps they should be pitied. I sometimes cannot resist the impulse to try to hold up a mirror before them, but I ought to know better than to think they will actually look into it. Of course I could be wrong about them. They could be just as obnoxious, pugnacious, and bullying in real life as they are here. And having gotten their way by such means, no longer understand the real nature of their actions. It which case it would be inaccurate to call them impotent: destructive might be the better word. The question that too few people in the world seems to ask is, Given that we are all very different from one another in out values and perceptions, and that those with whom we profoundly disagree are NEVER going away, how may be best live together? It seems to me that the people who are most comfortable in their own skins, who are really centered, who really know their own minds, are never troubled by the “wrong” opinions of others, nor feel any great urge to correct them, or argue with them. Needless to say, I don’t count myself among that number! I wish I could.
Night-Gaunt: there IS a “gender issue” here. One of the best kids I ever knew was killed on HER SECOND TOUR in Iraq by an IED that blew up her MRAP. Back when the “ladies” all stayed on the home front, hmm, in the Revolutionary War there were quite a few women who stayed home to defend the home, and “popped” some redcoats in the process. The “tough guys” all went off to war, even if they weighed 112 pounds and got drafted instead of the football player star who went on to become a pro, even with a “bum” knee.
Doughfoot said, about 3 hours ago@ConserveGov“Please explain what defines the difference, in your world, between “moderate conservative” “moderate liberal” “liberal” and “ultra-liberal”. I’m guessing that they all amount to the same thing, as far you’re concerned: left of yourself. For that matter, what is the difference, in your view, between conservative and ultra-conservative? And then what would define, again for you, someone whose opinions are to the right of you?”————————————————————————————————————Ok Dough, I’ll respond…….People who think Barry 0 is a secret Muslim or wants to destroy America are way too Right-Wing or just plain crazy.I just think he’s way under-qualified and too arrogant to admit it.I’m actually liberal on certain things, like potheads getting their dope taxed, abortion in certain circumstances and homosexuals that want to be married would be better off than spreading diseases everywhere.See, I’m a Moderate Conservative, like most of America.As for Liberals, I don’t think they are evil (like they call Conservatives), I just think they are naive. And sometimes hateful.Some liberals, like Lieberman and sometimes McIntyre and Barber are Moderate liberals who don’t want a nanny state.The rest are mostly Barry-loving, Big-Government, Limousine Liberals who pretend to care about the poor and middle-class but really look at us as little pigeons that need bread crumbs to keep the votes coming.Btw… Whoever said I was “attacking” other posters by calling them Liberal, Get a life!
said: “It seems for you it is fine as long as the court ordered it and it is done away from most eyes.”You’ve assumed much I see. It “seems”…
When I said I was speaking out of turn it is with regards defending martens and speaking unsolicited on her behalf, not with stepping into the conversation; just as you did earlier in the thread. And so it should be, this is a forum afterall.
martens said: “At least when we kill people by court order we do it somewhat more privately…but such ritual killing is still the mark of an uncivilized people”…what is difficult to read here? I do not see why martens has any need to explain herself any further.My trouble with your post is that you are even more self-righteous than I am. :-| (and that’s saying a lot)Again I will defend my good friend martens, who has been a consistent poster on this site for nigh on 10 years or more, and as ‘martens’ at least a year, if not two. Her opinion on capital punishment is very well known amongst the regulars. As I recognise you as a long time poster on this website as well, I fail to see how you could have missed martens’s posts on most subjects including capital punishment.
Dtroutma over 9 years ago
Now if “everyone” would just step up, and take away our opportunity to act alone, which actually is a better strategy, being worked on.
jnik23260 over 9 years ago
And if your hero George W Bush had not invaded Iraq, ISIS never would have come into existence in the first place!GWBush- the gift that keeps on giving!
Darsan54 Premium Member over 9 years ago
WoW!! Your disconnect from reality is absolutely stunning. A week of bombing? Really? And complaining about golfing is totally ironic in light of the past administration’s performance.
Doughfoot over 9 years ago
ISIS has attacked Iran border guards, and continues to battle Iran’s ally Bashir Assad. ISIS is getting funded by people inside the borders of our “friend and ally” Saudi Arabia. ISIS is the enemy of Hezbollah. When we attack ISIS we once again help Iran and its allies. Complicated isn’t it? Ah, well, Churchill helped Stalin fight Hitler. If Stalin and Churchill could be allies … We want to help the “good guys” but we’re having a hard time finding any in the southwestern Asia. The Kurds, I guess. Jordan, and (comparatively) Turkey and Israel. And some smaller groups here and there. If we could just get ourselves out from between Shiites and the Sunnis! And stop pretending this is ALL ABOUT US. We’re about as welcome there as the police are in the middle of a gang war.
Theodore E. Lind Premium Member over 9 years ago
Yes, we have to stop using gunboat diplomacy to control the rest of the world. Hopefully one day the human race will advance enough to solve problems cooperatively instead of fighting wars and killing off a few hundred thousand people.
grapefroot over 9 years ago
Ha ha! Michael wme – you crack me up!
6.6TA over 9 years ago
re.“^ umm, … Anyways, if once again, B Hussein Obama wasn’t golfing and fundraising for the past year, we would’ve wiped out ISIS in a week of bombing. ……”
One might consider that wiping “out ISIS in a week of bombing” would obviously be impossible. Unless one were willing to consider, say, nuclear carpet – bombing of Iraq and Syria, and make a dead zone of, say, another 100 miles in all directions around Iraq and Syria.
But, for almost all of us, this would be too horrible to contemplate.
Simon_Jester over 9 years ago
And when the Syrian civil war first broke out, what exactly, were you and the rest of the Tea-Party R’s saying Obama SHOULD have done about it, hmmmm?Let’s hear it, I’m waiting
Dtroutma over 9 years ago
David Ignatius and Fareed Zakeria (it bears repeating on this ‘toon as well) both have excellent columns today on the fact that it is the need for a coalition, NOT the U.S. going alone that Obama’s working on, and that’s vital to halt this ARAB ON ARAB problem, which is NOT a “Muslim” problem,as these groups opposed ARAB dictatorships long supported by the west. Zakaria points to the hundreds of millions of Muslims around the world, notably India and Indonesia (the largest Muslim population) who do NOT support ISIS, Al Qaeda, Taliban, or other radical nominative “Muslim” groups who routinely violate the scripture in the Quran, but spouting “crud” from latter day nut case “clerics”.
OmqR-IV.0 over 9 years ago
I may be speaking out of turn here but I can assure you, martens does not condone capital punishment of any type.martens said; “but such ritual killing is still the mark of an uncivilized people.”Read that again and examine who Martens includes with that criticism; it isn’t just Saudi Arabia.
Surely by now you must know where posters like martens stand on these points?
attarian over 9 years ago
Nice troll work. This is a regional; conflict, not one state attacking another. There are many factions in the fight; The Syrian government, and a few miscellaneous Syrian groups, Hezbollah, Kurds, Iranians and Al Qaeda, just to name a few.. it’s all complicated by the internal conflicts (Sunni and Shia for example) Blaming Bush or Obama completely misses the point. It’s our overly simplistic Mideast “policy” which for decades has consistently identified an individual actor (Iraq, Afghanistan, etc.) as the enemy. Of course the root of it all is the imperialists in Europe (British, French, Dutch et al) who took it upon themselves to jigger the borders and create new countries. Carpet bombing is a great bumper sticker strategy but just more of the same. Shock and awe anyone?
ConserveGov over 9 years ago
^^^ Or just “Have no strategy”.
Simon_Jester over 9 years ago
Got a link to back that up?
Simon_Jester over 9 years ago
Here Harley.
Doesn’t matter what Bush said at the UN ( IF he said it. ) He later SIGNED AN AGREEMENT with the Iraqis to pull our troops out by 2011.
http://www.politicususa.com/2014/06/15/republicans-blame-obama-iraq-bush-signed-agreement-leave.html
And when did YOU ever sign up to fight in Iraq, since you’re so gung-ho about it?
Simon_Jester over 9 years ago
Have you figured out that name-calling will get your posts flagged?
Doughfoot over 9 years ago
Please explain what defines the difference, in your world, between “moderate conservative” “moderate liberal” “liberal” and “ultra-liberal”. I’m guessing that they all amount to the same thing, as far you’re concerned: left of yourself. For that matter, what is the difference, in your view, between conservative and ultra-conservative? And then what would define, again for you, someone whose opinions are to the right of you? There are lots of people to the left of me, but who is to the right of you? And how would you distinguish between conservative and regressive? I think of a conservative as one who wants to conserve or preserve things that exist, while a regressive want go back and resurrect things that are gone (usually things that never existed at all). So tell us where you stand, rather than just throw rocks at everyone to the left of you.
Kip W over 9 years ago
Two people were beheaded, and Bill O’Reilly said we should stop criticizing the president and let him deal with it.
Of course, that was during the Bush administration. Now we should all lose our stuff over it.
Doughfoot over 9 years ago
Well, you know what they say, “I don’t express my opinion in the hope of changing anyone’s mind. I express my opinion so that others who think in a similar manner will not feel alone.” There do seem to be a certain set of people (left and right) who are so full of self-righteousness that they never give a moments thought to anything, however moderate or reasonable, with which they do not already agree. But worse, some of them seem to actually want to antagonize, insult, and bully others. They want to call them names, impugn their intelligence and their morals. They want a fight. I always imagine them to be people who impotent and humiliated in their real lives, playing out their combative fantasies behind the mask of anonymity that is the internet. And if it is so, perhaps they should be pitied. I sometimes cannot resist the impulse to try to hold up a mirror before them, but I ought to know better than to think they will actually look into it. Of course I could be wrong about them. They could be just as obnoxious, pugnacious, and bullying in real life as they are here. And having gotten their way by such means, no longer understand the real nature of their actions. It which case it would be inaccurate to call them impotent: destructive might be the better word. The question that too few people in the world seems to ask is, Given that we are all very different from one another in out values and perceptions, and that those with whom we profoundly disagree are NEVER going away, how may be best live together? It seems to me that the people who are most comfortable in their own skins, who are really centered, who really know their own minds, are never troubled by the “wrong” opinions of others, nor feel any great urge to correct them, or argue with them. Needless to say, I don’t count myself among that number! I wish I could.
Dtroutma over 9 years ago
Night-Gaunt: there IS a “gender issue” here. One of the best kids I ever knew was killed on HER SECOND TOUR in Iraq by an IED that blew up her MRAP. Back when the “ladies” all stayed on the home front, hmm, in the Revolutionary War there were quite a few women who stayed home to defend the home, and “popped” some redcoats in the process. The “tough guys” all went off to war, even if they weighed 112 pounds and got drafted instead of the football player star who went on to become a pro, even with a “bum” knee.
ConserveGov over 9 years ago
Doughfoot said, about 3 hours ago@ConserveGov“Please explain what defines the difference, in your world, between “moderate conservative” “moderate liberal” “liberal” and “ultra-liberal”. I’m guessing that they all amount to the same thing, as far you’re concerned: left of yourself. For that matter, what is the difference, in your view, between conservative and ultra-conservative? And then what would define, again for you, someone whose opinions are to the right of you?”————————————————————————————————————Ok Dough, I’ll respond…….People who think Barry 0 is a secret Muslim or wants to destroy America are way too Right-Wing or just plain crazy.I just think he’s way under-qualified and too arrogant to admit it.I’m actually liberal on certain things, like potheads getting their dope taxed, abortion in certain circumstances and homosexuals that want to be married would be better off than spreading diseases everywhere.See, I’m a Moderate Conservative, like most of America.As for Liberals, I don’t think they are evil (like they call Conservatives), I just think they are naive. And sometimes hateful.Some liberals, like Lieberman and sometimes McIntyre and Barber are Moderate liberals who don’t want a nanny state.The rest are mostly Barry-loving, Big-Government, Limousine Liberals who pretend to care about the poor and middle-class but really look at us as little pigeons that need bread crumbs to keep the votes coming.Btw… Whoever said I was “attacking” other posters by calling them Liberal, Get a life!
OmqR-IV.0 over 9 years ago
said: “It seems for you it is fine as long as the court ordered it and it is done away from most eyes.”You’ve assumed much I see. It “seems”…
When I said I was speaking out of turn it is with regards defending martens and speaking unsolicited on her behalf, not with stepping into the conversation; just as you did earlier in the thread. And so it should be, this is a forum afterall.
martens said: “At least when we kill people by court order we do it somewhat more privately…but such ritual killing is still the mark of an uncivilized people”…what is difficult to read here? I do not see why martens has any need to explain herself any further.My trouble with your post is that you are even more self-righteous than I am. :-| (and that’s saying a lot)Again I will defend my good friend martens, who has been a consistent poster on this site for nigh on 10 years or more, and as ‘martens’ at least a year, if not two. Her opinion on capital punishment is very well known amongst the regulars. As I recognise you as a long time poster on this website as well, I fail to see how you could have missed martens’s posts on most subjects including capital punishment.