I’m stumbling over the gist of this…who is the guy with the red head and robes uncorking the memories of nuclear holocaust ?
and, any memories of hiroshima have to be combined with the looming necessity of the looming estimated one million casulties) invasion of the japanese home island at the time..
it would have been inevitable that this terrible weapon was developed by SOMEone, somewhere….
satipera, you overlook the fact that the Emporer Hirohito had said that they were all soldiers in the fight. According to the doctrine they were living by it was the duty of every person to fight to the death to protect the empire. This disqualified any from being seen as civilians, or collateral damage. the women and children were prepared and training to fight to the last.
DrC, How could such a convoluted conclusion be wrought from the post. We did not start the war and if America was “all to happy to oblige” then we would have dropped many more nukes, even if they begged for us to stop. My point is that the Japanese had to be shown that we could indeed annihilate them completely if we had to. Then and only then did they capitulate.
@ Oldlego - the man who was responsible for the decision later said the bombs were necessary. That does not necessarily made it so. I can say it was the entrance of the USSR in the Pacific war that saved the lives of those US troops. Can you prove it was not?
Also, just because something might save soldiers’ lives does not necessarily make it right, even in war. Some of what the Germans were found guilty at in Nurenberg probably helped save the lives of some of their soldiers, too.
For all it matters, I think it might have been necessary - the first bomb, at first. That does not absolve the US of the responsibility for what it has done. Just because something is the best you could have done under the circumstances does not mean you should not be responsible for what happens.
I’ve been over the arguments on both sides and believe the bombing of Hiroshima and Nagasaki saved American lives. Part of this included talks with WWII vets who served in the Pacific. I do understand the wish that the A-bomb had never been invented but as charlie said, it was too late after the first test. It may very well have been to late after the basic research was done. It’s hard to keep that sort of thing locked up for long.
Every conflict has losses, what has to be done to lower the losses for your side and end the aggression of the enemy is the strongest course for victory..
I’ve been to the site of Nagasaki and Hiroshima.. Great tragedy and almost sublimely horrific if contemplated..
If I could stop it from ever happening, would I?
No..
I’d never place the lives of others over our own.. It goes by the old saying,”Patton? He was a bastard but sometimes it takes a sorry sumnabiatch to get the job done.”
That is, oldlegodad, only if HST and his team’s predictions were right, and nothing else would do. IF. And judging by how quickly Japan’s institutions collapsed after the war, I think they were wrong.
Well, what is done is done, and HST is dead now, so if he did wrong he answered for it. Yet just because something happened in history did not mean it was the right thing, or done for the right reasons.
What I mean is that Hiroshima started the Cold War. Since then, the US and nuclear countries have to invest billions in nukes never even meant to be used.
Sixty years of money-sucking nukes for a split second nuclear reaction.
That’s why Canada doesn’t have the bomb and doesn’t want it. We prefer to be smart enough to keep out of wars.
And don’t tell me we’d be invaded if it wasn’t for the US, we would be invaded by whom? China? We do trade with China.
Secondson, unless I’m misinformed, the United States did not have «many more nukes» to drop ; in fact «Little Boy» and «Fat Man» constituted the whole arsenal available at the time. Strategically, they had the desired effect - the Soviets, despite their defeat of the main contingents of the Japanese Army, which was located in Manchuria, found themselves excluded from the occupation regime in mainland Japan, and the Emperor system was preserved, at least in name. That hundreds of thousands of people, mainly civilians, were killed to attains these two great goals is par for the course….
CorosiveFrog Premium Member over 14 years ago
The nuclear can of worms that made us live in fear ever since.
Nighthawks Premium Member over 14 years ago
I’m stumbling over the gist of this…who is the guy with the red head and robes uncorking the memories of nuclear holocaust ?
and, any memories of hiroshima have to be combined with the looming necessity of the looming estimated one million casulties) invasion of the japanese home island at the time..
it would have been inevitable that this terrible weapon was developed by SOMEone, somewhere….
Dtroutma over 14 years ago
Nighthawk, look up the Japanese flag.
secondson over 14 years ago
satipera, you overlook the fact that the Emporer Hirohito had said that they were all soldiers in the fight. According to the doctrine they were living by it was the duty of every person to fight to the death to protect the empire. This disqualified any from being seen as civilians, or collateral damage. the women and children were prepared and training to fight to the last.
secondson over 14 years ago
Satipera, if you want to be so dismissive then your ears and mind are closed.
deadheadzan over 14 years ago
War is hell. Especially if you live in a war zone.
secondson over 14 years ago
DrC, How could such a convoluted conclusion be wrought from the post. We did not start the war and if America was “all to happy to oblige” then we would have dropped many more nukes, even if they begged for us to stop. My point is that the Japanese had to be shown that we could indeed annihilate them completely if we had to. Then and only then did they capitulate.
chromosome Premium Member over 14 years ago
Why does the bomb look like a pig (ears, eye and tail)?
4uk4ata over 14 years ago
@ Oldlego - the man who was responsible for the decision later said the bombs were necessary. That does not necessarily made it so. I can say it was the entrance of the USSR in the Pacific war that saved the lives of those US troops. Can you prove it was not?
Also, just because something might save soldiers’ lives does not necessarily make it right, even in war. Some of what the Germans were found guilty at in Nurenberg probably helped save the lives of some of their soldiers, too.
For all it matters, I think it might have been necessary - the first bomb, at first. That does not absolve the US of the responsibility for what it has done. Just because something is the best you could have done under the circumstances does not mean you should not be responsible for what happens.
CorosiveFrog Premium Member over 14 years ago
Were these two nukes worth the fear we’ve been living in for the past sixty years?
charliekane over 14 years ago
The genie had already left the bottle at the Trinity test site.
Hindsight is 20/20. I’ve never been persuaded by the revisionist historians on this one. I’m with ya, Lego.
Gladius over 14 years ago
I’ve been over the arguments on both sides and believe the bombing of Hiroshima and Nagasaki saved American lives. Part of this included talks with WWII vets who served in the Pacific. I do understand the wish that the A-bomb had never been invented but as charlie said, it was too late after the first test. It may very well have been to late after the basic research was done. It’s hard to keep that sort of thing locked up for long.
WestTex13 over 14 years ago
Every conflict has losses, what has to be done to lower the losses for your side and end the aggression of the enemy is the strongest course for victory..
I’ve been to the site of Nagasaki and Hiroshima.. Great tragedy and almost sublimely horrific if contemplated..
If I could stop it from ever happening, would I?
No..
I’d never place the lives of others over our own.. It goes by the old saying,”Patton? He was a bastard but sometimes it takes a sorry sumnabiatch to get the job done.”
4uk4ata over 14 years ago
That is, oldlegodad, only if HST and his team’s predictions were right, and nothing else would do. IF. And judging by how quickly Japan’s institutions collapsed after the war, I think they were wrong.
Well, what is done is done, and HST is dead now, so if he did wrong he answered for it. Yet just because something happened in history did not mean it was the right thing, or done for the right reasons.
CorosiveFrog Premium Member over 14 years ago
What I mean is that Hiroshima started the Cold War. Since then, the US and nuclear countries have to invest billions in nukes never even meant to be used.
Sixty years of money-sucking nukes for a split second nuclear reaction.
That’s why Canada doesn’t have the bomb and doesn’t want it. We prefer to be smart enough to keep out of wars.
And don’t tell me we’d be invaded if it wasn’t for the US, we would be invaded by whom? China? We do trade with China.
mhenriday over 14 years ago
Secondson, unless I’m misinformed, the United States did not have «many more nukes» to drop ; in fact «Little Boy» and «Fat Man» constituted the whole arsenal available at the time. Strategically, they had the desired effect - the Soviets, despite their defeat of the main contingents of the Japanese Army, which was located in Manchuria, found themselves excluded from the occupation regime in mainland Japan, and the Emperor system was preserved, at least in name. That hundreds of thousands of people, mainly civilians, were killed to attains these two great goals is par for the course….
Henri