Jim Morin for March 21, 2010

There was a time when the Conservative Attitute was, “Hey, I got mine, so the Hell with everyone else – No Reform - No Change - I like how the system is working!”

Now, based on most of the post we see, the Consevative Attitute seems to be: “If you don’t agree with me you are evil, you hate America, you are cowards and will surrender to the terrorist, you want to destroy our Freedoms!”

Such blind hate not only makes it impossible to have a discussion, or reach a compromise, it means the Conservatives can be stampeded in any direction the GOP wants, even when it is destroying the very freedoms the Conservatives say they love.

KillBill Volume 4

Poophead, we are over having the 2000 election stolen from under us. You should get over losing the 2008 election by an overwhelming margin.

As for putting things where they don’t belong, I rather have a cigar in an intern than our troops in Iraq. No one died because of that cigar which can’t be said of Bush’s folly.

We already HAVE greater expense, reduced availability and loss of freedom. It’s known as the Current system.

Where are all he headstones of the Insured? Having insurance does not guarantee life. That is something no one can guarantee.

“Because your political enemies have shown their philosophy is superior to yours and you have to fight it or admit your inherent weakness of logic?”

Planned Parenthood should receive no funding because special needs children are God’s punishment for aborting a first born child? I bow to the strength of the logic of my political enemies there. Need more? I’ve got plenty examples of the power of the superior Republican logic.

“greater expense”

The current health care bill being voted on is a deficit reducing maneuver as declared by the non-partisan CBO, not like those “amazing” Bush tax cuts and Medicare changes. It’s also less expensive.

As for “His Pooperness” http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/article/2010/mar/19/top-5-lies-about-health-care/

Ten things you should know about the healthcare reform bill: http://tinyurl.com/ycjr8fp Pooperness: 1) Long established. The prices Americans pay for lesser healthcare (measured in terms of results) are well known. We pay 50% more than the British, and get far worse results, and don’t even cover all the country. 2) Bushwah. More than 40 million Americans are without insurance - up to one in six by some estimates. That isn’t a crisis? 3) Just because you say so, don’t mean it’s so. See the Politifact findings. Had we gotten single-payer, or even the public option, it would undoubtedly have lowered costs, but the Republicans and blue-dog Democrats squashed those. This reform is more Republican than Democrat! 4) You’re reaching. 5) It’s morally deficient to save lives? Who do you worship, Shiva the Destroyer? 6) Not true, see Politifact. 7) “Wards of the state?” Not so. Compare to countries with real national healthcare. Didn’t happen. 8) As opposed to the fraud perpetuated by insurance companies every day? 9) Go read about it: http://tinyurl.com/ycjr8fp

With all those dead or dying because of lack of care or lack of insurance, the big 0 keeps bringing up examples that are easily discredited as such.

Where’s the beef?

Ken said: “Now, based on most of the post we see, the Consevative Attitute seems to be: “If you don’t agree with me you are evil, you hate America, you are cowards and will surrender to the terrorist, you want to destroy our Freedoms!””

This is EXACTLY how they got the votes that got us into Iraq, despite all the evidence contrary to their claims, and the millions around the world who protested entry into war.

They now make the same claim against anyone who truly DOES WANT TO HELP AMERICA.

To me, that constitutes the ultimate TREASON and they should be called out for it at every opportunity.

Helping the gov. is not nesseceraly helping America. Reduce gov. reduce taxes. Get rid of entitlements and handouts and yes I must be a hartless bastard who wants to keep what I earn. SO WHAT!

davesmithsit, Do you know that you do not have to take Social Security or Medicare? The same is true to all the rest of you who hate the socialist programs.

So what are we going to talk about after tonight? I suppose there’s always evolution and climate change.

bruce, may I comment on your post intended for “just Ken?” respectfully, glorious gorilla

lonecat, next should be financial service industry regulatory reform …. if it’s illegal to be a bookie for side bets on sports games, why is it legal to make hedge fund side bets on Wall St.? At least they gotta take up the Volker rules!

@lonecat - ENDA.

“Uh, wrong! 34Democrats nay, every Republican voted nay,over two-hundred. Tigger”

Conservative Math.

Why do Conservatives piously profess love of country and a strong military, but see no responsibility to pay its bills?

^^^ Bruce – I so much agree that we should avoid lumping people together in vague and sweeping generalizations. I will try to do my part, and I hope others will make an effort as well.

Howgozit - have you noticed the unfunded military expenditures, pharmacare, pork barrel projects etc., etc., resulting in out of control budget deficits that threaten to bring down the country?

In a general sense, with the exceptlion of Clinton, I was referring to previous administrations running up out of control deficits. I’ll give Obama a temporary pass since he inherited a mess not of his making. But, I have also heard in various ways many times, from what I assume are conservatives, that taxation is “stealing our money”. You can hear this daily on conservative talk-radio. I say simply - If you love your country, you had better be prepared to pay for the country’s legally and / or legislated committed expenditures. (Sort of like a marriage!) I’ll concede I’m generalizing about conservatives.

I would like to point out to the Conservatives that posted here, that we LIBS, even when we disagreed with you, or caught you in a lie about how DEMS voted, none of them, including me, every said that you were evil, trying to destroy our freedoms, or made personal attacks.

My post was not directed at all Conservatives, just the ones who come on line, spray hate and anger, and never bother to address the questions that have been posted.

I do believe that it is best for America for our Government to be as Liberial as possible, because it is suppose to be a Government For The People, and I also believe that the 8 years under Bush were amoung the worse for freedom and our rights in history, but I blame that on the GOP and the people who were in charge, not on Conservatives as a whole.

^ Well, Ken, I think I do recall a few heated exchanges on both sides. Even some personal remarks.

For my part, I do believe that most conservatives sincerely want what they think is best for the country. I hope they grant me the same sincere desire. If each side grants the sincerity of the other, maybe we can have some productive discussion.

bruce, what I wanted to ask (and may already have done so) is about your statements that your taxes have already gone up. Yet there haven’t been any tax increases, I don’t think. I think we’ve talked about this before, was it related to the stimulus checks? And you indicated elsewhere you thought you would lose your union health plan … why do you think you would lose your union health plan?

”First test is the “changes” that have been promised. Think that will happen?”

The House did pass the amendments right after they passed the Sen. bill. Now, the Senate has to pass the amendments and the GOP has promised parliamentary challenges.

Not to put too fine a point on this, but normally there is a conference committee assigned to reconcile differences to Senate and House versions of bills, resulting in one final bill both houses would vote on. But sending the bill to conference committee was denied by filibuster, which is why amendments were passed to be “reconciled.”