The only solution to this problem would be — government regulation! Some sort of independent board as insulated from political pressure as possible (as possible) that would make redistricting decision based on some fixed set of criteria. So that the district actually represents a community. This is why, whatever its faults, the European system has real attractions. If the libertarians get 20% of the vote in every district in America, they get no representation. In many European countries they get 20% of the seats in the legislatures. And that would certainly be more just, more fair, than what we have in our legislatures. Not that it would not pose certain problems, too. But think of he number of places that are firmly in the pocket of one party or the other. If you happen to be in the minority party in that district or state, your vote literally will never matter. And we wonder why voter turn-out is low, and apathy and cynicism abound! In my adult life, I have hardly ever voted for a candidate who won, as I live in a state and district that rare elects anyone of whom I approve. How many people are there in the this country who would love to vote for the Tea Party, or the Libertarians, or the Greens, or the Socialists, or the Strict Constitutionalists, or whatever, who are forced always to choose between Reps and Dems or quixotically throw their vote away on a snowball’s-chance candidate? How many of us believe that our members of congress, that our members of out state legislature really represent us, our values, and our interests? Of course, when we say they only represent themselves, or that congress does not speak with the people’s voice, we are saying that the whole system of representative democracy has failed. We are saying exactly what radicals of the left and right, Lenin and Hitler, said: that our claim to self-government is bogus. I deny that. The congress does speak for us, though imperfectly. We have to respect that, or neither our laws nor our government any longer has any claim to legitimacy, no matter who wins the elections. But surely we could do better. My European friends (those who have lived on both sides of the Atlantic) are always amazed at how much attention our politicians get. “It’s all about celebrity and ego and personality in America,” they say. “Our politicians are viewed as functionaries doing a job, not the ‘leaders of the nation’ as it is with you. Nobody fawns over them here as they do in your county, and politics don’t constantly intrude into our lives as they do in America.” “Oh, would some Power the small gift give us to see ourselves as others see us! It would from many a blunder free us, and foolish notion: what airs in dress and gait would leave us, and even devotion!” — with apologies to Robert Burns for changing the dialect.
^ With a lot of European countries, you’re voting for a party slate, not the individual, too, so they don’t cultivate the personality cult approach that we do. Most Americans view voting for their representative as something different than voting for a party.Of course, exact proportional representation means a lot of coalition building, haggling, and votes of no confidence from all the other factions.
You’re such a silly, one dimensional tool! The republicans are doing the same here in Georgia, just as they did 10 years ago and I’m sure it goes on in all or most of the other states as well . Also, your democratic national socialist party label is just too ridiculous. At this point in history, this is a center/center right party. Eisenhower would have been considered a leftist compared to Obama.
Come on out to Utah. They still Gerrymander (we’re creating a new one as we speak), only it’s to make sure we’re not represented by any of those bad old Democrats with their Socialist agenda.
Since we have he census data, and we know how the districts are supposed to be composed, this could all be done by computer in about 5 min with no error and no political nonsense. But without the political nonsense, computerization would never be OKed by the pols.
We are doing it different in California. I think it will be better. Gerrymandering is the worst of the worst, giving who ever is in charge the right to change the bourders. Computer generated districts could work also
“Do both parties do it, yes again.” …in Florida… Last time the D’s did the Gerrymander. This time the R’s are goiing to do it. So the D’s put an Issue on the ballot to force the R’s to do it ‘fairly’. Some one was thinking ahead.
aardvarkseyes over 12 years ago
No rhyme or reason..
kreole over 12 years ago
What tha?
Joe1962 Premium Member over 12 years ago
He makes it clear that Maryland has a rig election that goes to the democratic that runs.
Doughfoot over 12 years ago
The only solution to this problem would be — government regulation! Some sort of independent board as insulated from political pressure as possible (as possible) that would make redistricting decision based on some fixed set of criteria. So that the district actually represents a community. This is why, whatever its faults, the European system has real attractions. If the libertarians get 20% of the vote in every district in America, they get no representation. In many European countries they get 20% of the seats in the legislatures. And that would certainly be more just, more fair, than what we have in our legislatures. Not that it would not pose certain problems, too. But think of he number of places that are firmly in the pocket of one party or the other. If you happen to be in the minority party in that district or state, your vote literally will never matter. And we wonder why voter turn-out is low, and apathy and cynicism abound! In my adult life, I have hardly ever voted for a candidate who won, as I live in a state and district that rare elects anyone of whom I approve. How many people are there in the this country who would love to vote for the Tea Party, or the Libertarians, or the Greens, or the Socialists, or the Strict Constitutionalists, or whatever, who are forced always to choose between Reps and Dems or quixotically throw their vote away on a snowball’s-chance candidate? How many of us believe that our members of congress, that our members of out state legislature really represent us, our values, and our interests? Of course, when we say they only represent themselves, or that congress does not speak with the people’s voice, we are saying that the whole system of representative democracy has failed. We are saying exactly what radicals of the left and right, Lenin and Hitler, said: that our claim to self-government is bogus. I deny that. The congress does speak for us, though imperfectly. We have to respect that, or neither our laws nor our government any longer has any claim to legitimacy, no matter who wins the elections. But surely we could do better. My European friends (those who have lived on both sides of the Atlantic) are always amazed at how much attention our politicians get. “It’s all about celebrity and ego and personality in America,” they say. “Our politicians are viewed as functionaries doing a job, not the ‘leaders of the nation’ as it is with you. Nobody fawns over them here as they do in your county, and politics don’t constantly intrude into our lives as they do in America.” “Oh, would some Power the small gift give us to see ourselves as others see us! It would from many a blunder free us, and foolish notion: what airs in dress and gait would leave us, and even devotion!” — with apologies to Robert Burns for changing the dialect.
meetinthemiddle over 12 years ago
^ With a lot of European countries, you’re voting for a party slate, not the individual, too, so they don’t cultivate the personality cult approach that we do. Most Americans view voting for their representative as something different than voting for a party.Of course, exact proportional representation means a lot of coalition building, haggling, and votes of no confidence from all the other factions.
tcolkett over 12 years ago
You’re such a silly, one dimensional tool! The republicans are doing the same here in Georgia, just as they did 10 years ago and I’m sure it goes on in all or most of the other states as well . Also, your democratic national socialist party label is just too ridiculous. At this point in history, this is a center/center right party. Eisenhower would have been considered a leftist compared to Obama.
DavidGBA over 12 years ago
I look forward to computer generated district maps: most compact districts with right number of voters, no political tweaking.
Wildcard24365 over 12 years ago
Come on out to Utah. They still Gerrymander (we’re creating a new one as we speak), only it’s to make sure we’re not represented by any of those bad old Democrats with their Socialist agenda.
AdmNaismith over 12 years ago
Since we have he census data, and we know how the districts are supposed to be composed, this could all be done by computer in about 5 min with no error and no political nonsense. But without the political nonsense, computerization would never be OKed by the pols.
baileydean over 12 years ago
Shallow waters run again, and again, and again, and again…
Carolo1 over 12 years ago
We are doing it different in California. I think it will be better. Gerrymandering is the worst of the worst, giving who ever is in charge the right to change the bourders. Computer generated districts could work also
chromosome Premium Member over 12 years ago
The districts the Republicans designed for the Detroit area are more bizarre-looking than the Wikipedia entry for Gerrymandering.
Fuzzy Thinker Premium Member over 12 years ago
“Do both parties do it, yes again.” …in Florida… Last time the D’s did the Gerrymander. This time the R’s are goiing to do it. So the D’s put an Issue on the ballot to force the R’s to do it ‘fairly’. Some one was thinking ahead.
rekam Premium Member over 12 years ago
They (the Republicants) are doing it here right now, too. In Riverside County in California.
Carolo1 over 12 years ago
Remember Tom Delay