“Violence endured too long leads to moral anesthesia. It degrades even religious leaders. Society is seperated into sacrificial lambs and those who wield the knives. High-sounding labels mask the bloody reality: phrases with words such as “Freedom” and “Political Autonomy” and the like. Such words have little meaning in a world without morality.” —Father Michael Flannery
The White Plague by Frank Herbert
Be careful Ted, criticizing Israel’s policies is the surest way to be labeled an anti-semetic Nazi. You’ll be following Helen Thomas to the re-education camp.
The world is being held hostage by 7 million people.
Israel has created on of the world’s worst refugee crises, ever, and no one is allowed to say anything about it? Well f*ck Israel- they created this mess when they insisted on being planted where they are, and they haven’t played nice with their neighbors in any way to make up for that. They need to grow up and realize there are other people in the world.
If they can’t share thinks like Jerusalem, maybe it should be taken away from them.
So many Jew-haters…it is not just Helen Thomas.
If anti-Israel speakers would assess history, the fact is that the Jews are the daily target of 22 Arab governments,
and have only been exercising the UN-acknowledged right of national defense since Independence, May 14, 1948.
The Israelis allow billions of aid to reach the Arab/Muslim population in Gaza….food, water, etc….and give Arab citizens medical care and voting rights.
Try to find that situation in any of the 22 Arab nations!
The Iranians and others have been using subterfuge to smuggle weapons and ammo into Gaza which the militants have made a launching pad for daily rockets aimed at Israeli men, women and children.
Even Egypt is Israel’s partner in the blockade, and in trying to stem the tunnel-digging on the Egyptian border.
But Jew-haters see only blame for the victims and the target, never seeing the Arab’s hate and warring as worthy of condemnation.
I agree, sirromsirrom. I don’t often chime in on Israeli-Palestinian issues, because my opinions won’t please either extreme, and it seems like the extreme statements are the only ones anybody hears (or wants to hear). It’s possible to oppose current Israeli policy yet still be a Zionist. It’s also possible to be anti-Zionist without being anti-Semitic. No doubt somewhere there are true Jew-haters who support the recent Israeli actions…
“Among the most disturbing political phenomena of our times is the emergence in the newly created state of Israel of the “”Freedom Party”” (Tnuat Haherut), a political party closely akin in its organization, methods, political philosophy and social appeal to the Nazi and Fascist parties. It was formed out of the membership and following of the former Irgun Zvai Leumi, a terrorist, right-wing, chauvinist organization in Palestine.
The current visit of Menachem Begin, leader of this party, to the United States is obviously calculated to give the impression of American support for his party in the coming Israeli elections, and to cement political ties with conservative Zionist elements in the United States. Several Americans of national repute have lent their names to welcome his visit. It is inconceivable that those who oppose fascism throughout the world, if correctly informed as to Mr. Begin’s political record and perspectives, could add their names and support to the movement he represents.
The public avowals of Begin’’s party are no guide whatever to its actual character. Today they speak of freedom, democracy and anti-imperialism, whereas until recently they openly preached the doctrine of the Fascist state. It is in its actions that the terrorist party betrays its real character; from its past actions we can judge what it may be expected to do in the future.”
Under the influence of politicians, masses of people tend to ascribe the responsibility for wars to those who wield power at any given time. In World War I it was the munitions industrialists; in World War II it was the psychopathic generals who were said to be guilty.This is passing the buck. The responsibility for war falls solely upon the shoulders of these same masses of people, for they have all the necessary means to avert war in their own hands. In part by their apathy, in part by their passivity, and in part actively, these masses of people make possible the catastrophes under which they themselves suffer more than anybody else. To stress this guilt on the part of masses of people, to hold them solely responsible, means to take them seriously. On the other hand, to commiserate masses of people as victims, means to treat them as small, helpless children. The former is the attitude held by genuine freedom-fighters; the latter the attitude held by the power-thirsty politicians.”
Yes, how is it that billions of people could some day begin to dislike jews?
How could such behaviour perpetuate itself over thousands of years? In so many different countries, from so many various cultures and religions?
Certainly not the fault of a few millions Jews, isn’t it? Millions of people cannot be wrong… But billions are. Obviously…
How could someone not love such a nice religion (Read tradition, or way of life) that does promote slavery, genocide and ethnic cleansing as religious duties?
Have a look at some of the 613 Mitzvot (Commandments, still to be obeyed today), like:
. To keep the Canaanite slave forever (Lev. 25:46).
. To slay the inhabitants of a city that has become idolatrous and burn that city (Deut. 13:16-17)
. To destroy the seed of Amalek (Deut. 25:19) (CCA77)
. Not to keep alive any individual of the seven Canaanite nations (Deut. 20:16)
. To exterminate the seven Canaanite nations from the land of Israel (Deut. 20:17)
For more of it, Google “Mitzvot” or jump to: http://www.jewfaq.org/613.htm
In the Halakhah (Legal system of classical Judaism), the term ‘Gentiles’ refers to all non-Jews.
According to the Halakhah, the duty to save the life of a fellow Jew is paramount. However:
. Jew who murders a Gentile is guilty only of a sin against the laws of Heaven, not punishable by a court.
. To cause indirectly the death of a Gentile is no sin at all.
. In war, when our [Israeli] forces storm the enemy, they are allowed and even enjoined by the Halakhah to kill even good civilians, that is, civilians who are ostensibly good.
. As for Gentiles with whom we are not at war … their death must not be caused, but it is forbidden to save them if they are at the point of death; if, for example, one of them is seen falling into the sea, he should not be rescued, for it is written: ‘neither shalt thou stand against the blood of thy fellow’ - but [a Gentile] is not thy fellow.”
Interested? Read “Jewish History, Jewish Religion: The Weight of Three Thousand Years”, by Professor Israel Shahak at http://www.biblebelievers.org.au/jewhis1.htm
“Chap.5: The Laws Against Non-Jews” at http://www.bintjbeil.com/E/occupation/shahak.html
That’s real nitty-gritty stuff, and I hope it doesn’t get flagged and dismissed as “anti-Semitic” by small-minded people. The fact is that much of the Old Testament doctrine was so antithetical to the collective wisdom of the Western ancient world that it’s no wonder other cultures found it abhorrent. For another modern theory, check out this long paragraph from Moses and Monotheism by Sigmund Freud (1939):
“The deeper motives of anti-Semitism have their roots in times long past; they come from the unconscious, and I am quite prepared to hear that what I am going to say will at first appear incredible. I venture to assert that the jealousy which the Jews evoked in other peoples by maintaining that they were the first-born, favourite child of God the Father has not yet been overcome by those others, just as if the latter had given credence to the assumption. Furthermore, among the customs through which the Jews marked off their aloof position, that of circumcision made a disagreeable, uncanny impression on others. The explanation probably is that it reminds them of the dreaded castration idea and of things in their primeval past which they would fain forget. Then there is lastly the most recent motive of the series. We must not forget that all the peoples who now excel in the practice of anti-Semitism became Christians only in relatively recent times, sometimes forced to it by bloody compulsion. One might say they are all “badly christened”; under the thin veneer of Christianity they have remained what their ancestors were, barbarically polytheistic. They have not yet overcome their grudge against the new religion which was forced on them, and they have projected it on to the source from which Christianity came to them. The facts that the Gospels tell a story which is enacted among Jews, and in truth treats only of Jews, has facilitated such a projection. The hatred for Judaism is at bottom hatred for Christianity, and it is not surprising that in the German National Socialist revolution this close connection of the two monotheistic religions finds such clear expression in the hostile treatment of both.”
It is still possible that some Israeli people are for peace(even though their leaders are shot down by fundy;s), and that not all are scared into total submission( after ALL these are Jews!).
They understand that hamas was created by the anti communists BY THEIR OWN GOVERNMENT OF ISRAEL, the war mongers of their nation, and they will continue to pay for such short sightedness.
As an American I’d be upset if MY government used tax $$ to promote and send groups against my nation…(think the U.S. army sending in under cover agents to “act -up” spit on returning troops f/ Viet Nam, and causing violence at free demonstrations…)
OR FUNDING osama to attack communists in Afghan, for FUNDING Hitler while he attacked communism,1939- the Frankenstein creations always come back to attack the hands that feed them…
This too will be uncovered, short term terror( CREATED Hammas and funded by war mongers in their gov, to get re-elected, ( producing the strangest mentally insane BLIND following) vs LONG term PEACE for ALL in the area.
Most people everywhere are basically well-meaning, and most people are also brainwashed. Forgive them, for they know not what they do, but don’t let them get away with it, either.
Sir H. Kissinger is no longer in charge of U.S. foreign policy, (we showed him the door after the last election)take the chance for peace, stop funding hammas, and sit at the table with the PLO.
And do not kill everyone at the PLO government offices(as you did b4) and demand they end the rockets attacks.
Sit with the PLO, let them send in the peace keepers to GAZA, to clean up the mess the warmongers created.
DUH.
Even tho Hillary and the C.F.R. has you all set up for a war w/Iran, do not be the chumps.
let peace break out.
disgustedtaxpayer, you neglected to play the Holocaust card. The rockets were almost all homemade and short range which caused little damage. There have been no rockets for quite some time. Hamas has moderated their position on negotiating with the Israelis. There are more facts you choose to ignore, but I imagine there is no point in listing them.
The militant “Never again!” philosophy, though understandable, has spawned the classic situation where a victim overcompensates by becoming just as dangerous to others as the original person who abused them was.
myming almost 14 years ago
1 down.
i love flagging these people !
rottenprat almost 14 years ago
To which she replies, “Can I shave my legs first?”
mattro65 almost 14 years ago
Shame on you Ted! Don’t you know that the Israelis can do no wrong? Just ask a Federal legislator.
sirrom567 almost 14 years ago
You, too, can make pennies an hour by flooding public websites indiscriminately with spam! Great business opportunity! Annoy your friends!
Jaedabee Premium Member almost 14 years ago
^^^ I know right, I wouldn’t want to be dragged around anywhere with my legs all hairy either. Bleh.
cfimeiatpap almost 14 years ago
“Violence endured too long leads to moral anesthesia. It degrades even religious leaders. Society is seperated into sacrificial lambs and those who wield the knives. High-sounding labels mask the bloody reality: phrases with words such as “Freedom” and “Political Autonomy” and the like. Such words have little meaning in a world without morality.” —Father Michael Flannery The White Plague by Frank Herbert
Palestino almost 14 years ago
I hope to see the killers of the 9 peace activists in Heague international criminal court someday in the future….
wmclay almost 14 years ago
Be careful Ted, criticizing Israel’s policies is the surest way to be labeled an anti-semetic Nazi. You’ll be following Helen Thomas to the re-education camp.
sirrom567 almost 14 years ago
More info, if anybody cares:
http://investing.businessweek.com/research/stocks/snapshot/snapshot.asp?ticker=147:HK
AdmNaismith almost 14 years ago
The world is being held hostage by 7 million people.
Israel has created on of the world’s worst refugee crises, ever, and no one is allowed to say anything about it? Well f*ck Israel- they created this mess when they insisted on being planted where they are, and they haven’t played nice with their neighbors in any way to make up for that. They need to grow up and realize there are other people in the world. If they can’t share thinks like Jerusalem, maybe it should be taken away from them.
sirrom567 almost 14 years ago
The world is actually being held hostage by 7 billion people.
disgustedtaxpayer almost 14 years ago
So many Jew-haters…it is not just Helen Thomas. If anti-Israel speakers would assess history, the fact is that the Jews are the daily target of 22 Arab governments, and have only been exercising the UN-acknowledged right of national defense since Independence, May 14, 1948.
The Israelis allow billions of aid to reach the Arab/Muslim population in Gaza….food, water, etc….and give Arab citizens medical care and voting rights.
Try to find that situation in any of the 22 Arab nations!
The Iranians and others have been using subterfuge to smuggle weapons and ammo into Gaza which the militants have made a launching pad for daily rockets aimed at Israeli men, women and children.
Even Egypt is Israel’s partner in the blockade, and in trying to stem the tunnel-digging on the Egyptian border.
But Jew-haters see only blame for the victims and the target, never seeing the Arab’s hate and warring as worthy of condemnation.
sirrom567 almost 14 years ago
To conflate opposition to Israel’s policies with Jew-hating bespeaks only ignorance and false logic.
fritzoid Premium Member almost 14 years ago
I agree, sirromsirrom. I don’t often chime in on Israeli-Palestinian issues, because my opinions won’t please either extreme, and it seems like the extreme statements are the only ones anybody hears (or wants to hear). It’s possible to oppose current Israeli policy yet still be a Zionist. It’s also possible to be anti-Zionist without being anti-Semitic. No doubt somewhere there are true Jew-haters who support the recent Israeli actions…
wmclay almost 14 years ago
“Among the most disturbing political phenomena of our times is the emergence in the newly created state of Israel of the “”Freedom Party”” (Tnuat Haherut), a political party closely akin in its organization, methods, political philosophy and social appeal to the Nazi and Fascist parties. It was formed out of the membership and following of the former Irgun Zvai Leumi, a terrorist, right-wing, chauvinist organization in Palestine.
The current visit of Menachem Begin, leader of this party, to the United States is obviously calculated to give the impression of American support for his party in the coming Israeli elections, and to cement political ties with conservative Zionist elements in the United States. Several Americans of national repute have lent their names to welcome his visit. It is inconceivable that those who oppose fascism throughout the world, if correctly informed as to Mr. Begin’s political record and perspectives, could add their names and support to the movement he represents.
The public avowals of Begin’’s party are no guide whatever to its actual character. Today they speak of freedom, democracy and anti-imperialism, whereas until recently they openly preached the doctrine of the Fascist state. It is in its actions that the terrorist party betrays its real character; from its past actions we can judge what it may be expected to do in the future.”
Albert Einstein, Dec. 2, 1948cfimeiatpap almost 14 years ago
Under the influence of politicians, masses of people tend to ascribe the responsibility for wars to those who wield power at any given time. In World War I it was the munitions industrialists; in World War II it was the psychopathic generals who were said to be guilty.This is passing the buck. The responsibility for war falls solely upon the shoulders of these same masses of people, for they have all the necessary means to avert war in their own hands. In part by their apathy, in part by their passivity, and in part actively, these masses of people make possible the catastrophes under which they themselves suffer more than anybody else. To stress this guilt on the part of masses of people, to hold them solely responsible, means to take them seriously. On the other hand, to commiserate masses of people as victims, means to treat them as small, helpless children. The former is the attitude held by genuine freedom-fighters; the latter the attitude held by the power-thirsty politicians.”
–Wilhelm Reich, The Mass Psychology of Fascism.
sirrom567 almost 14 years ago
Albert Einstein – such a “self-hating Jew”! Thank god we have Noam Chomsky today.
(I trust you can recognize irony….)
YouWereWarned almost 14 years ago
So many Jews haters… How could it be?
Yes, how is it that billions of people could some day begin to dislike jews? How could such behaviour perpetuate itself over thousands of years? In so many different countries, from so many various cultures and religions?
Certainly not the fault of a few millions Jews, isn’t it? Millions of people cannot be wrong… But billions are. Obviously…
How could someone not love such a nice religion (Read tradition, or way of life) that does promote slavery, genocide and ethnic cleansing as religious duties?
Have a look at some of the 613 Mitzvot (Commandments, still to be obeyed today), like:
. To keep the Canaanite slave forever (Lev. 25:46). . To slay the inhabitants of a city that has become idolatrous and burn that city (Deut. 13:16-17) . To destroy the seed of Amalek (Deut. 25:19) (CCA77) . Not to keep alive any individual of the seven Canaanite nations (Deut. 20:16) . To exterminate the seven Canaanite nations from the land of Israel (Deut. 20:17)
For more of it, Google “Mitzvot” or jump to: http://www.jewfaq.org/613.htm
In the Halakhah (Legal system of classical Judaism), the term ‘Gentiles’ refers to all non-Jews. According to the Halakhah, the duty to save the life of a fellow Jew is paramount. However:
. Jew who murders a Gentile is guilty only of a sin against the laws of Heaven, not punishable by a court.
. To cause indirectly the death of a Gentile is no sin at all.
. In war, when our [Israeli] forces storm the enemy, they are allowed and even enjoined by the Halakhah to kill even good civilians, that is, civilians who are ostensibly good.
. As for Gentiles with whom we are not at war … their death must not be caused, but it is forbidden to save them if they are at the point of death; if, for example, one of them is seen falling into the sea, he should not be rescued, for it is written: ‘neither shalt thou stand against the blood of thy fellow’ - but [a Gentile] is not thy fellow.”
Interested? Read “Jewish History, Jewish Religion: The Weight of Three Thousand Years”, by Professor Israel Shahak at http://www.biblebelievers.org.au/jewhis1.htm “Chap.5: The Laws Against Non-Jews” at http://www.bintjbeil.com/E/occupation/shahak.html
sirrom567 almost 14 years ago
That’s real nitty-gritty stuff, and I hope it doesn’t get flagged and dismissed as “anti-Semitic” by small-minded people. The fact is that much of the Old Testament doctrine was so antithetical to the collective wisdom of the Western ancient world that it’s no wonder other cultures found it abhorrent. For another modern theory, check out this long paragraph from Moses and Monotheism by Sigmund Freud (1939):
“The deeper motives of anti-Semitism have their roots in times long past; they come from the unconscious, and I am quite prepared to hear that what I am going to say will at first appear incredible. I venture to assert that the jealousy which the Jews evoked in other peoples by maintaining that they were the first-born, favourite child of God the Father has not yet been overcome by those others, just as if the latter had given credence to the assumption. Furthermore, among the customs through which the Jews marked off their aloof position, that of circumcision made a disagreeable, uncanny impression on others. The explanation probably is that it reminds them of the dreaded castration idea and of things in their primeval past which they would fain forget. Then there is lastly the most recent motive of the series. We must not forget that all the peoples who now excel in the practice of anti-Semitism became Christians only in relatively recent times, sometimes forced to it by bloody compulsion. One might say they are all “badly christened”; under the thin veneer of Christianity they have remained what their ancestors were, barbarically polytheistic. They have not yet overcome their grudge against the new religion which was forced on them, and they have projected it on to the source from which Christianity came to them. The facts that the Gospels tell a story which is enacted among Jews, and in truth treats only of Jews, has facilitated such a projection. The hatred for Judaism is at bottom hatred for Christianity, and it is not surprising that in the German National Socialist revolution this close connection of the two monotheistic religions finds such clear expression in the hostile treatment of both.”
jaxaction almost 14 years ago
It is still possible that some Israeli people are for peace(even though their leaders are shot down by fundy;s), and that not all are scared into total submission( after ALL these are Jews!).
They understand that hamas was created by the anti communists BY THEIR OWN GOVERNMENT OF ISRAEL, the war mongers of their nation, and they will continue to pay for such short sightedness.
As an American I’d be upset if MY government used tax $$ to promote and send groups against my nation…(think the U.S. army sending in under cover agents to “act -up” spit on returning troops f/ Viet Nam, and causing violence at free demonstrations…) OR FUNDING osama to attack communists in Afghan, for FUNDING Hitler while he attacked communism,1939- the Frankenstein creations always come back to attack the hands that feed them…
This too will be uncovered, short term terror( CREATED Hammas and funded by war mongers in their gov, to get re-elected, ( producing the strangest mentally insane BLIND following) vs LONG term PEACE for ALL in the area.
sirrom567 almost 14 years ago
Most people everywhere are basically well-meaning, and most people are also brainwashed. Forgive them, for they know not what they do, but don’t let them get away with it, either.
jaxaction almost 14 years ago
OR, ISRAEL wake up!,
Sir H. Kissinger is no longer in charge of U.S. foreign policy, (we showed him the door after the last election)take the chance for peace, stop funding hammas, and sit at the table with the PLO.
And do not kill everyone at the PLO government offices(as you did b4) and demand they end the rockets attacks.
Sit with the PLO, let them send in the peace keepers to GAZA, to clean up the mess the warmongers created. DUH.
Even tho Hillary and the C.F.R. has you all set up for a war w/Iran, do not be the chumps. let peace break out.
sirrom567 almost 14 years ago
Bravo.
pbarnrob almost 14 years ago
Always FLAG spammers. (I follow to their profile and see where they’ve been, and flag them there too!)
Take the ‘Boulder Pledge’; Never deal with spammers, EVER!
sirrom567 almost 14 years ago
You can follow the profile only so far. When they hit over 100 different cartoons, it’s a lost cause.
mattro65 almost 14 years ago
disgustedtaxpayer, you neglected to play the Holocaust card. The rockets were almost all homemade and short range which caused little damage. There have been no rockets for quite some time. Hamas has moderated their position on negotiating with the Israelis. There are more facts you choose to ignore, but I imagine there is no point in listing them.
SuperGriz almost 14 years ago
Using a bulldozer to crush an American teenage girl, Rachel Corrie, was also very effective.
http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=54d_1188265466
wmclay almost 14 years ago
The militant “Never again!” philosophy, though understandable, has spawned the classic situation where a victim overcompensates by becoming just as dangerous to others as the original person who abused them was.
sirrom567 almost 14 years ago
Blitzkrieg – Germany, World War II
Lightning War – Israel, Six-Day War
Lt_Lanier almost 14 years ago
@ Pbarnrob, aren’t you spamming by default, you big spam ham?
*As duly noted.
Always FLAG spammers. (I follow to their profile and see where they’ve been, and flag them there too!)
Take the ‘Boulder Pledge’; Never deal with spammers, EVER!