Listen folks, is better to make (keep actually) spying on Americans legal, for otherwise there’s always an intelligence agency willing to do it illegally, and this means no oversight, and thus possibly entailing a worse outcome for anyone under the microscope, no matter how actually benign, but potentially disruptive for particular power groups and/or special interests the subject under surveillance is, (e.g. John Lennon, Martin Luther King Jr, or maybe even Ted).
But saying “the government” is an over-generalization however, and I think that’s quite inaccurate. It’s only a few power groups pulling the strings on other power groups when it comes down to controlling certain outcomes– and that’s about it. Saying “the government” thus strikes me as unfair, unless you do so for the sake of brevity. The whole deal strikes me as if you guys are taking the whole deal as something very dear and personal. It is not. We are just drops in the bucket. No one is interested in how many times we get a lap dance and whatnot. No one is out to hurt us.
Unless you really, really, really make noise, as with the examples aforementioned. And even then, it is not ‘the government” as I explained. Especially now that there has been a fracture in the consolidated powers, aka, the establishment, as more and more people are awakened to a higher consciousness, or to a new understanding, if that sounded too New Ageish and kooky.
I don’t know about that Corrosive, that gives performance anxiety/stage fright a new meaning to me.
I am not on Facebook and I have strong privacy issues. While I am aware that the information age makes it impossible to remain totally private I do try to limit my exposure. This site is about the highest exposure I allow. I do think before posting personal information here.
I do not automatically trust any government organization to ignore me because I’m “insignificant.” I spoke of the government in general since the post I responded to was not specific. However, my ‘logic’ post still applies. If you can’t pass a law because a government agency will break it, you have a problem no matter what the law is.
Hardly is there anything as clear cut as, say, pregnancy, either a woman is pregnant or she is not. With matters of law enforcement and intelligence however nothing is ever so clear-cut, and so laws have always been continually bent or even broken. Even before the Patriot Act was enacted. That just gave it a name and a lawful justification.
What matters is, however, the intention; is a law being circumvented to reach or keep or maintain a noble goal, or is it born out of a debased self-interest or a misplaced sense of purpose?
It’a a slippery slope and we’ve already slipped too far to stop it, what with GPS, red light cams, surveillance in stores and building lobbies, laptops spying on students, nosy co-op boards, meddling child services agencies…. No FISA court is going to restore your lost privacy. Don’t get involved in anything, don’t post anything, pay your taxes on time, and keep your phone unlisted. And don’t have kids! You can’t really escape, but you can try to be invisible and not make waves. (And if you have an Arabic name, forget it.)
Lavocat about 14 years ago
J. Edgar Hoover is laughing his bleeep off (while getting reamed by Satan).
SuperGriz about 14 years ago
Dept. of Homeland Voyeurism?
mattro65 about 14 years ago
The more things change, the more they remain the same. Vote third party, break the grip of the rich and powerful on the federal government.
edmondd about 14 years ago
Listen folks, is better to make (keep actually) spying on Americans legal, for otherwise there’s always an intelligence agency willing to do it illegally, and this means no oversight, and thus possibly entailing a worse outcome for anyone under the microscope, no matter how actually benign, but potentially disruptive for particular power groups and/or special interests the subject under surveillance is, (e.g. John Lennon, Martin Luther King Jr, or maybe even Ted).
Gladius about 14 years ago
Sorry edmondd, I have a problem with logic behind: legalise it since the government is going to break the law anyway.
Unless perhaps, you offered this in jest?
CorosiveFrog Premium Member about 14 years ago
Too bad I don’t live in the states, it turns me on to think someone is watching while I’m doin’ it!
edmondd about 14 years ago
Nope, not jesting Gladius.
But saying “the government” is an over-generalization however, and I think that’s quite inaccurate. It’s only a few power groups pulling the strings on other power groups when it comes down to controlling certain outcomes– and that’s about it. Saying “the government” thus strikes me as unfair, unless you do so for the sake of brevity. The whole deal strikes me as if you guys are taking the whole deal as something very dear and personal. It is not. We are just drops in the bucket. No one is interested in how many times we get a lap dance and whatnot. No one is out to hurt us.
Unless you really, really, really make noise, as with the examples aforementioned. And even then, it is not ‘the government” as I explained. Especially now that there has been a fracture in the consolidated powers, aka, the establishment, as more and more people are awakened to a higher consciousness, or to a new understanding, if that sounded too New Ageish and kooky.
I don’t know about that Corrosive, that gives performance anxiety/stage fright a new meaning to me.
Dtroutma about 14 years ago
Tiger, Tiger, not so bright, turn your phone off, do it right.
Of course, with everyone posting on farcebook and other “private” sources, the real nuts are already “public”.
Gladius about 14 years ago
I am not on Facebook and I have strong privacy issues. While I am aware that the information age makes it impossible to remain totally private I do try to limit my exposure. This site is about the highest exposure I allow. I do think before posting personal information here.
I do not automatically trust any government organization to ignore me because I’m “insignificant.” I spoke of the government in general since the post I responded to was not specific. However, my ‘logic’ post still applies. If you can’t pass a law because a government agency will break it, you have a problem no matter what the law is.
edmondd about 14 years ago
Hardly is there anything as clear cut as, say, pregnancy, either a woman is pregnant or she is not. With matters of law enforcement and intelligence however nothing is ever so clear-cut, and so laws have always been continually bent or even broken. Even before the Patriot Act was enacted. That just gave it a name and a lawful justification.
What matters is, however, the intention; is a law being circumvented to reach or keep or maintain a noble goal, or is it born out of a debased self-interest or a misplaced sense of purpose?
sirrom567 about 14 years ago
It’a a slippery slope and we’ve already slipped too far to stop it, what with GPS, red light cams, surveillance in stores and building lobbies, laptops spying on students, nosy co-op boards, meddling child services agencies…. No FISA court is going to restore your lost privacy. Don’t get involved in anything, don’t post anything, pay your taxes on time, and keep your phone unlisted. And don’t have kids! You can’t really escape, but you can try to be invisible and not make waves. (And if you have an Arabic name, forget it.)
comYics about 14 years ago
That’d be nice to make 400k per year.
parkersinthehouse about 14 years ago
no WONDER you don’t have an avatar
ºO U
Gladius about 14 years ago
If I did, it would probably be deliberately deceptive :)
SuperGriz about 14 years ago
edmondd,
Me love Bizarro World., too.