Doonesbury by Garry Trudeau for July 26, 2012

Let me guess which party those 20% belong to.

“bad asses” isn’t the phrase which describes them suitably.

“When governments fear the people, there is liberty. When the people fear the government, there is tyranny.” Please note that for the government to fear the people the people do not have to be armed.

No democracy in the US anymore – well I guess it depends on your the definition of democracy.

I’m curious who the other 80% were. Now where I live in Boston, MA, there are always a sizeable number of “ineligible voters” on the roll, because when people move — and they often do — they rarely bother to tell the voter registration people to take them off. So it takes a year or two for them to get purged. No fraud is involved, or if it is, it’s very rare, but there don’t catch anyone.Is that what makes up the other 80%?

No, the other 80% were ineligible. They may have died, or moved. As chassimmons pointed out, no fraud intended. People who move don’t bother to inform the election board, and people who are dead can’t inform the election board.

The lack of faith we have in the Republicans is one of their weapons.

Jim Crow is historically a Democrat. They invented him to put dowb the blacks, who at that time voted Republican.

And Florida fired an employee who tried to NOTIFY the purgees that they had been dropped from the voting rolls! They were only supposed to be told when they went to vote!

…and many states do not deny the vote to convicted felons!

Who’ll notice? The rest of the world. Those countries which the US wants to adopt democracy or which the US criticizes for not being properly democratic, oh, they’ll notice. Also people in other democracies who still can’t quite get their heads round Bush/Gore and what a dire effect that on subsequent events in the rest of the world. Unfortunately what you guys do still matters globally.

I’ve often wondered what it would take to start a new revolution in this country of apathetics. A Romney win with the help of Republican voter suppression laws would do it.

Dems have no problem with dead dogs voting…..unless they vote for the other guy….

Jimmy is right Florida is never a big deal in a Presidential election.

If Egypt can have voter i.d., I think we probably can too. We and everyone have to have i.d. for everything else we do, so why not for the most important thing?

“What party controlled both the Congress and White House when the Civil Rights Act of 1964 and the Voting Rights Act of 1965 were passed and signed?” Um, which party had a larger percentage voting in favor of the act? I have yet to meet a person from either party who would disallow a person from voting based upon race. They only want to make sure the people voting are who they say they are and are eligible. What do you have against needing and ID?

another dirty little secret is that many precints in FL had FIVE times the number registered voters than residents because it has been so long since they were purged. The biggest reason for being purged even if you were elligilble to vote? NOT VOTING AT ALL FOR FIVE YEARS OR MORE!!!

Somehow you did not understand the point which even one of the commentators had made to explain this. The 80% were not fraudulent. They were simply inelegible to vote. No one ever claimed anywhere that these names were used to vote. And I will repeat the story in Texas where the Republican Attorney General spent a couple of years and millions of dollars to investigate voter fraud. He found seven instances and only three of those were truly an intentional effort to vote when they should not have. I think the other four involved people voting in the wrong precinct because they had moved and did not realize they needed to update their registration. Meanwwhile, seven votes out of millions cast does not constitute a threat to our democracy in Texas.

Oh where to begin….

An amendment is just that – a change to th constitution. Which means all of what you posted are constitutional rights. That means the constitution absolutely guarantees the right to vote….

Now if we follow your logic, then one of two options applies…1) none of the amendments are really constitutional rights and therefore your favorite, the second, also goes away, so I’ll have those guns now. Or2) your long post is completely irrelevant and wrong

Amm 24 as you pointed out says you cannot have a poll tax. Requiring an ID that you must pay for is the same thing and that is the issue with the laws…

Www.mittromneyisaunicorn.com

Unless the GOP is smart enough to put Marco Rubio on the ticket ( in the vain hope of pandering to the Latino voters ) , I have a feeling that once again Florida will remain a swing state with a very narrow margin deciding the winner. And given our Governor Scott’s predilection for controversy and collusion, I won’t be at all surprised if Florida’s voter repression doesn’t wind up at the Supreme Court. It certainly will gain national attention just as our famous "hanging chads " did. Stay tuned, children. Florida’s just beginning to disgrace itself. Wait for the GOP convention in Tampa. Oh boy !

When the NAACP met in Houston a little while back there was a specific discussion related to voter ID laws and how it would disenfranchise black voters. In order to get into the auditorium you had to present picutre ID. And the irony is lost on nearly everyone.

The vote is not in until the dead are counted. Raylon Givens

Voting laws and regulations were and still are primarily up to the states according to our Constitution.

“In its 2000 ruling, Alexander v Mineta, the [U.S. Supreme] Court … affirmed the district court’s interpretation that our Constitution ‘does not protect the right of all citizens to vote, but rather the right of all qualified citizens to vote.’ And it’s state legislatures that wield the power to decide who is ‘qualified.’ As a result, voting is not a right, but a privilege granted or withheld at the discretion of local and state governments…. the U.S. is one of just 11 nations among 120 or so constitutional democracies that fail to guarantee a right to vote in their constitutions.”

Today’s Republicans would not be recognized by Lincoln, T.R. or even Eisenhower. On the other hand, Harding and Nixon would likely feel right at home among the Ryans and the Roves.

Does this not indicate that 80% were ineligible?

Trying to reason with the racist right is a total waste of time. May I suggest to my fellow liberals that you go to a hardware store and buy a bag of hammers. It will give you a much more reasonable conversation.

Mighty Richard…you are RIGHT ON…old diehards in privacy have told me that the Reep attempt to ‘get into’ the Amendments…were a) to start with the libeled ‘anchor babies’and then b) votes for women…

c) hey, folks, how you like them horse apples?

@BorntalkingbackJust read your request from yesterday.

The whistle blower’s name was Mike Connell. He was the chief IT consultant to Karl Rove. He was to testify regarding the 2004 Ohio election and was killed in an “accidental” private airplane crash on Dec 19, 2008. He had received death threats and had expressed fear that Bush and Chenney were going to take him out. He had asked for protective custody but had not yet received a response.

The voting machines used in the Ohio election were Diebold machines. I remember reading that the president of Diebold had bragged give me the contract (for the voting machines) and I’ll give you Ohio. I guess he did.

Most Diebold machines are DRE (Direct Recording Electronic) voting machines meaning they are electronic only – no paper records. The machines were networked together and the results sent to a computer in Tennessee for tabulating. Problem is all three private companies managing the vote count were owned or affiliated with Connell. The computer in Tennessee was the same machine that Karl Rove used to host his emails to bypass secrecy and retention laws. The Secretary of State for Ohio, Ken Blackwell, was a republican and is the one who OKays the contracts for the voting machines and the vote counting. Why would you legitimately have your family jewels – the state’s votes – sent to a computer without state oversight located in a basement in another state? Unless maybe you want to delay the count while you figure out how many votes to change?

Mike Connell had admitted to Stephen Spoonamore, a conservative Republican, a former McCain supporter and a very prominent expert at the detection of computer fraud, that he had helped Bush & Chenney steal elections and had also asked Spoonamore how to destroy White House emails.

In addition to the vote tampering in Ohio, Diebold was also involved in vote count fraud in Georgia, Wisconsin, Maryland and a host of other states. In fact, it was reported that “80% of the votes counted in this country are in the hands of Republican backed voting technology”. Time after time, computer security experts (and some not so expert), have shown how easy it is to hack the machines and skew the votes.

Each county purchases their own machines and, I suspect, many (most?) tried to save a few bucks by not going the printed paper audit route. Now its a CYA operation as well as Diebold (and others) do not want to lose control of the vote.

Here are some links to get started but you can also google the names or google “voting machine glitch OR fraud”. Some URLs were very long so I used a shortener.

http://www.macon-bibb.com/voting.htmhttp://preview.tinyurl.com/cfhcwy8http://www.bradblog.com/?cat=403http://preview.tinyurl.com/secpronewshttp://preview.tinyurl.com/velvetrevhttp://preview.tinyurl.com/stecoblgspthttp://www.freedumbnation.com/?p=2392

It’s interesting to me just how unconcerned the wingnuts are about Americans voting. The prevailing sentiment is “I’ve got picture ID and can vote, so what’s the problem?”. This just proves to me that they understand that they can’t win on the merits of the pitiful arguments they put forward and have to rely on vote suppression to win.

The extremist view: If you don’t look like me you better not vote.

From:http://foxnewsinsider.com/2012/01/23/report-more-than-900-dead-people-voted-in-south-carolina-elections/

A voter fraud controversy is currently taking place in South Carolina after the Department of Motor vehicles discovered that 953 deceased registered voters appeared to have voted in state elections.…

According to the report, some of the voters passed away as far back as six years ago…

A side note on convicted felons and voting. Some states (Texas for one) do not cross reference the voting rolls with the conviction lists, thus making it possible for a convicted who has not completed their sentence (and thus had their franchise restored) to cast a ballot. Probably many other states don’t bother checking either.

I would say that it should be as hard to vote as it is to cash a check. I would also say that the Republicans are pushing the rules because more Democrats don’t have picture ids than do Republicans. I would say it is fair to assume that some of the 80% of Florida voters of were improperly on the voting rolls would have voted.

And likening this to Jim Crow is a little bit over the top.

I followed your link, but I can’t believe I wasted the time.

There was no evidence of voter fraud in the article. There was no evidence, or even a clear implication, that a single bad registration was filed.

This company was mailing mostly blank registration forms, the same ones that are freely available online or at voter registrations sites all over the state. They received the proper clearance from the state board of elections, thus the operation was approved as legal. Their mailing list wasn’t perfect, as none of them ever are, and they sent some forms to ineligible voters. Once again, simple clerical errors are being portrayed as some kind of gross fraud.

There is no constitutional requirement to have a picture ID, either. This country has run just fine for the past almost 250 years without voter ID, unless of course you don’t like having the current President in office.

I agree with @beprepn and extend his comment – this whole discussion is over the top. Conservative fears of non-citizens voting and other fraud are out of proportion to reality. So are liberal fears of voter disenfranchisement. Both concerns are probably true, but in smaller numbers than people fear.

Would you please explain why you keep bringing up crap from decades ago, like it matters?The party you are attempting to call racist nominated and backed the US’s first black president. Your point is ridiculous.

As a database expert, I think that 1) We should have a national photo ID. Valid IDs are very important. That is not because of potential voter fraud, but as a way to reduce identity theft and give database people like me unique ids to work with. It’s remarkable how many people have identical names and birthdates. However, fraudulent IDs are a booming business already, so this is not a panacea.2) There will always be errors in data, no matter what we do. We need to make it as easy as possible to fix any issues that arise.3) Make allowances for missing documentation, transportation difficulties, and other similar realities. Understand that this program will have costs and could result in tax increases. Make it free to the public and incorporate it into the drivers’ license bureaus.

An amendment to the constitution is “the constitution.”

You misunderstood. The 80% did not attempt to vote, so they were not fraudulent voters. They were registered when ineligible, but that’s not their fault, either. It is the state’s responsibility to purge the registrations, not the voter’s.

No, but knowing we’re stuck in a country with such ignorance abounding? That hurts.

Please sir, explain to me what makes me a racist. I am curious as to how your mind works.

I hear I’m a racist, too. I guess it’s the worst insult he can use, so I guess I can call him a terrorist.

@einarbt7I wouldn’t call it either a democracy or a republic. It’s more like a corporate powered plutocracy. With all the corporate money out there don’t you think that some of it is spent on funding trolls to pollute fora/forums like this one?

You display all of the class and thought that the Redfern kid does in GT’s strip. It’s like aspiring to be like Fred Flintstone or Snuffy Smith or Hagar the Horrible.You’re a credit to your beliefs.

You keep accusing everyone else of being a racist.You remind me of those characters you often see on street corners, wearing their tin-foil hats and screaming “I’m not crazy, you’re the one who’s crazy!”p.s. You white hood is showing.

The Democrap Gov. you are speaking of is George Wallace, and I’d accept the term Democrap for him. But he left the Democrats to run as an independent in ‘68, and never returned.Nor would he have been welcomed back.And the kinds of Republicans who supported the Civil Rights Act in the 1960’s wouldn’t have a shot at getting a Republican nominatiuon in the 2010’s.The GOP shouldn’t refer to itself as “The Party of Lincoln.” Abe would be apalled at these Republicans.How about “The Party of Rove, Gingrich and Limbaugh?”Works for me, and the GOP should be proud of these 3 stalwarts. Aren’t they?

When did I mention you as racist? I was referring to today’s Republican Party in general. I know this is hard for you to comprehend, but it is not all about you. I am now going to talk to my bag of hammers for some rational conversation.

"Corporate America, and big business will insure that the candidate that will line their pockets the most efficiently will win, and “The Public Be Damned!”Yes, after the SCOTUS rendered the terrible Citizens United decision two years ago, unlimited corporate money has completely flooded the system.Nevertheless, corporate political advertising has diminishing returns after the first $1 billion or so.But the best way to neutralize the unlimited donations and perserve our democracy . . . is for We the People to always pay attention . . . and to always look for the facts!

“Your last point ignores the simple fact that if the Democrat Party had had it’s way, the Civil Rights act would never have passed.” Lying again! A large majority of Congressional Democrats supported the Civil Rights Act. The Democrats who voted for the Act did not make up a majority, so it is fair to say that the Democrats could not have passed the Civil Rights Act without Republicans. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Civil_Rights_Act_of_1964#By_party

And the people who disagree with you are traitors and usurpers, right?

There are a a few nutjobs in Egypt who have spouted nonsense about tearing down the ancient monuments. Got any evidence of an Islamic Brotherhood candidate promising that? Much like here, the Egyptian election is about the economy and restoring some semblance of social justice. The majority of Egyptians would not just stand by if someone tries to destroy their heritage, and it would be the end of the Islamic Brotherhood Party if they started talking seriously about it.

Hey “Snoopster” – You mean DUMB asses!(Just like you!)By the way, is that your real name?

FloridaA study conducted by the Florida Sun Sentinel in late October 2008 found:More than 65,000 ineligible and duplicate voters on Florida’s registration rolls.600 dead people on the list.

http://ballotpedia.org/wiki/index.php/Dead_people_voting

Mississippi has 123% more registered voters than people over the age of 18. 486 registered voters are listed over the age of 105, and 190,000 new voters registered to vote for the 2008 election, and that’s only 2 States… Read about all the states… Republican, and Democrat, and Independent by the way…Loose Voter verification on all sides need to be cleaned up, not just the Democratic side, which I am.

After looking at Guard SGT’s ridiculous claim about tearing down the pyramids, I found an article on a Tea Party website. An extremist in Bahrain called for the destruction of the Pyramids and other antiquities. No one in Egypt The article is so full of Islamophobia and historical inaccuracies that it would be funny, except we have plenty of bigots who want to believe these things.

On the contrary, GSGT, I find you and your ilk extremely scary. You’re like a bunch of schoolyard bullies who figure if you yell loudly enough and berate and demean all who do not follow you, you will get to be “King of the Schoolyard.”You and your type will stop at nothing to get what you want; truth, fair play and ethics are just the weakling’s baggage to you, and the callousness of your actions doesn’t deter you one bit.It doesn’t take any boldness or courage to be a Conservative; anyone can find the guts to defend “themselves and their kin.” Being a Liberal, standing up for the rights of others, letting everyone have their say whether you agree or not, fighting for the causes that don’t directly benefit you, but help others in need, that is a sign of true bravery. Heroes are those who do for themselves, Heroes do for others.

And save yourself the trouble of telling me I’m a racist, you’ve already made that message quite clear.

So, basically all you can say is, “It’s not you, it’s me” Can we raise this above grade school level?

When have I ever attacked the GOP based on something they did over 40 years ago? Never Why? Because it would have little if any relevance to the platform they support today.

I can’t imagine anyone over 40 starting a post with “BWAHA HA HA HA HA!!!”, so I’m pretty sure you’re talking about things that happened well before you were born, as if you really know what the country was like back then. Seems you haven’t a clue.

Whether or not you are racist is irrelevant. What you are is a certified fool. Even my bag of hammers can see that.

“Being liberal is telling all exactly what they must do and not do”

That’s more of a straw monster than a straw man. Guard, when did you stop thinking? At what point in your life was your philosophy so set in stone that you refuse to listen to anything that doesn’t fit your preconceived notions?

“To them the pyramids are an afront to Islam. So they must go.”

This was never a realistic threat; just another time that you were misinformed by your radical right news sources. As often as they have been wrong, I can’t understand why you still listen to them.

Yup, it’s Florida and what could be worse than W?