Stuart Carlson by Stuart Carlson

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  1. lbalch

    lbalch said, 5 months ago

    As the anti abortion leaders call the late dr. a mass murderer and pure evil they claim it wasn’t our fault. Hypocrites and hate mongers all.

  2. Jethan

    Jethan said, 5 months ago

    I heard on the news that the shooter was unconnected to anti-abortion people.

  3. Anthony 2816

    Anthony 2816Genius_badge said, 5 months ago

    Read a few more news stories about it, Jethan.

    What may have confused you is that many of the mainstream anti-abortion groups are trying to distance themselves from him.

  4. churchillwasright

    churchillwasright said, 5 months ago

    It will be interesting to read the liberal editorials (and cartoons) condemning the hate mongering anit-military vitriol of the left wing press and pundits for their responsiblity in the assassination of the military recruiter (and wounding of his colleague) in Little Rock.

    Update: The dead and wounded were recruits, not recruiters, and the (alleged) assassin was a black muslim, though his motive isn’t clear.

    Now I know there won’t be any additional reports on the MSM.

  5. dtroutma

    dtroutma said, 5 months ago

    With 38,000 “Christian” denominations- whose law is law? There were people put in Guantanamo who had less to do with fomenting terror, and attacks on people, than some of the “pro-life” folks already screaming out, while they say they don’t “really” condone what happened. Check out what Bill O’Reilly had to say about this doctor.

    What the heck does an Army recruiter have to do with a DOCTOR saving women’s lives?

  6. Simon_Jester

    Simon_Jester said, 5 months ago

    Who in the so-called the left-wing press has been denouncing our miltiary recruits as mass-murderers and demanding retribution, churchillwasright?

    How many comments on say, Democratic Underground have been praising the Little Rock killers as heroes and saying the victims got what was coming to them?

    I think we both know the answer, Neville…and THAT’S the difference!

  7. believecommonsense

    believecommonsenseGenius_badge said, 5 months ago

    hate-mongering, fear-mongering, and demonizing people DOES have an effect and we’ve seen it again and again

    whatever you belief about abortions, Tiller operated within the law. Just heard O”Reilly say “others” called Tiller a baby murderer, as if he didn’t call Tiller a murderer repeatedly himself

    the right is now using this murder of a man during a church service as another chance to vent … O’Reilly’s piece tonight acknowledged the murder was wrong, then moved back to the usual ranting

    Tiller’s murder DOES matter, it is homicide

  8. Anthony 2816

    Anthony 2816Genius_badge said, 5 months ago

    Just another example of the fact that “pro-life” doesn’t mean pro-life at all.

    It just means “pro-fetal-life”.

    I’ll bet the murderer is convinced that this cold-blooded murder will guarantee him a place in heaven.

    Just like the 9/11 terrorists.

  9. churchillwasright

    churchillwasright said, 5 months ago

    SIMON: I do not consider extremist blogs– left or right– as “media”. If I did, then I would assume that those who celebrated the death of Tony Snow on Huff Post (just as one example) was the prevailing viewpoint of liberals– which I don’t.

    As for calling our military murderers, you can start with Senator Murtha.

    As for O’Reilly, he believes abortion is murder, and says so. He’s entitled to his opinion– unless you think only those who agree with the left are entitled to their opinion. He has never “demanded retribution” in any concievable way, nor do I think he condones this.

  10. Greeneyed Texan

    Greeneyed TexanGenius_badge said, 5 months ago

    O’Reilly has said he does not condone what was done to Dr. Tiller. I am pro-life and could not stand the man one bit but the man who cold blooded killed him is the same type murderer as he felt Dr. Tiller was. Only God has the right to punishment by death. I do not believe in Capital punishment either. Life is precious from conception until death. All Life, even terrible people have the right to life as God has given us. Only He has the right to take it away. I am sorry for the Tiller family who must be devastated. O”Reilly is not a hate monger. He stands up for children’s rights.

  11. Simon_Jester

    Simon_Jester said, 5 months ago

    When did Murtha say that? What was the context?

    Tony Snow has nothing do with this. And he was NOT murdered.

    The opinions of the extremist blogs DO matter It was such an extremist that gunned down Dr. Tiller.

  12. danielsangeo

    danielsangeo said, 5 months ago

    “O’Reilly has said he does not condone what was done to Dr. Tiller.”

    And yet O’Reilly has said, repeatedly went after Dr. Tiller. For example, O’Reilly has called Dr. Tiller as “operating a death mill”, having “blood on his hands”, that he was “executing babies about to be born”, that he was “guilty of Nazi stuff”, that he “destroys fetuses for just about any reason right up until the birth date for $5,000”, and the moral equivalent of Al Qaeda.

    “This is the kind of stuff that happened in Mao’s China, Hitler’s Germany, Stalin’s Soviet Union.” –Bill O’Reilly

    Yes. O’Reilly says he doesn’t condone the murder.

  13. Gary Kleppe

    Gary Kleppe said, 5 months ago

    “Just another example of the fact that ‘pro-life’ doesn’t mean pro-life at all.

    It just means ‘pro-fetal-life’.”

    No, it doesn’t even mean that. The infant mortality rate in the USA is far higher than in countries with universal health care, yet these people don’t care. Anti-abortion crusading is simply a power trip, born (so to speak) out of a need to impose one’s own beliefs on others.

  14. DrCanuck

    DrCanuck said, 5 months ago

    The last few times a gunman opened fire in a church, the right-wing-nuts all started screaming that it was time for church-goers to carry guns to return fire. Not a peep out of them this time!

  15. jwlong

    jwlong said, 5 months ago

    To the extent of my knowledge… Operation Rescue, the Pro-life organization that he was supposedly connected to is all but defunct (their website is dead). I would also like to add that regardless of your religious opinion on the subject, Abortion is the result of racism. Initially the only people that were recommended abortions were minorities.

    This is not about Right vs. Left. It’s about Right vs. Wrong.

    Let each state decide. Each state is a separate entity joined together for the sake of defense. So, in essence, since they are sovereign, let each state choose whether to allow abortions or not and stop encouraging the “supreme” court to overrule them…

  16. churchillwasright

    churchillwasright said, 5 months ago

    SIMON:”… they [Marine] killed innocent civilians in cold blood.”
    (Murtha, May 17, 2006 at news conference)

    “There was no firefight. There was no IED that killed these innocent people. Our troops overreacted because of the pressure on them, and they killed innocent civilians in cold blood”
    (Murtha, May 19, 2006)

    “They actually went into the houses and killed women and children. And there was about twice as many as originally reported by Times.”
    (Murtha, Reuters, May 19, 2006)

    “Our troops over-reacted because of the pressure on them, and they killed innocent civilians in cold blood.”
    (Murtha, ARAB WORLD NEWS, May 19, 2006)

    And only a dope would consider extremest blogs “media”, but then you probably get your news from the Huff Post and Media Matters.

  17. danielsangeo

    danielsangeo said, 5 months ago

    jwlong: They do. But, passing laws against it are tough due to privacy laws and the Constitution (4th Amendment).

    churchillwasright: Again, what’s the context for these quotes? Who is “they”? Murtha didn’t just up and say this out of the blue, did he?

  18. Anthony 2816

    Anthony 2816Genius_badge said, 5 months ago

    Jwlong, I think at the present date our states are joined together for a lot more than just common defense.

  19. tpenna

    tpennaGenius_badge said, 5 months ago

    The problem with comparing Dr. Tiller’s work to that done in Nazi Germany is that many people believe that any attempt to stop Hitler’s regime would have been justified (including assassinating him).

    Use of such language (as well as the language of abortion as “murder”) does nothing productive for the debate. All it does is heighten rhetoric and encourage extremism.

  20. cdward

    cdward said, 5 months ago

    churchillwasright, isn’t there documented evidence of US troops on occasion killing noncombatants? From what you quote, that’s about all Murtha is saying. It’s clear he’s not calling all US troops murderers. We know that some are because they were court martialed and convicted (by the US military). Do you condemn Murtha for stating what’s reported by the military?

  21. Corosive Frog

    Corosive Frog said, 5 months ago

    churchill; DUH! That stuff happens in wars. BUT, the ones I hold responsible for all that Hell are not the soldiers of any nations bu the leaders who started it (you know the ones I am taking about).

  22. Corosive Frog

    Corosive Frog said, 5 months ago

    Think about the proportions this story would take if the murderer had done it for the same reason but happened just happened, to be a muslim or had just slightly darker skin.

  23. twieliczka

    twieliczkaGenius_badge said, 5 months ago

    How soon before every Church going person has to start worrying about getting shot by a Pro-Abortion person?

  24. TrickyPickle

    TrickyPickle said, 5 months ago

    Tpenna, I disagree that the use of the word murder should be excluded on the grounds that it is unproductive. I think it is central to the issue. If you believe that human life begins at conception, then killing a fetus is indeed murder. If you believe that human life begins at birth, then an abortion is just a health choice. A pro-choicer who has an abortion does NOT believe they are committing murder. The friction happens because pro-lifers think they ARE committing murder and as such are obligated to prevent it where possible. This leads to comments like Gary Kleppe’s above, who believes that pro-lifers are imposing their beliefs on others. This is an emotionally charged issue with strong arguments on both sides.

  25. dtroutma

    dtroutma said, 5 months ago

    Is miscarriage murder?

  26. Gary Kleppe

    Gary Kleppe said, 5 months ago

    Please stop calling them “pro-lifers”. They are anything but.

    Most of them supported the invasion and occupation of Iraq, which killed millions of innocent people.

    They generally don’t care about the people dying as a result of our horrible privatized system of health care financing. The USA’s infant mortality rate is something like three time’s that of Sweden (for example).

    And now they are GUNNING DOWN DOCTORS. How much more un-pro-life can you get?

  27. tpenna

    tpennaGenius_badge said, 5 months ago

    TrickyPickle, I appreciate your comment (and your screen name, which has quite a bit of relevance to this debate). But I will maintain that the word “murder” elevates the debate to a more instinctively violent level. Whereas its use may be deemed accurate by some, there can be little denying its potentially harmful consequences.

    By saying this, I do not mean that the use of the word “murder” leads necessarily to what happened to Dr. Tiller. By no means! But it does lead to a tendency to de-personalize other people who disagree with you. A pro-choice person becomes no longer a “person”. They are now a “supporter of murder”.

    Check out the response to Tiller’s murder by a coalition of leaders on both sides of the abortion debate at http://tinyurl.com/qab4g9. (I hope the link works.)

  28. tpenna

    tpennaGenius_badge said, 5 months ago

    And Gary Kleppe, as a liberal, I agree that all of the issues you raise are incredibly important and are often ignored. But you paint with too broad a brush. “They” are not, as you say, “gunning down doctors”. Scott Roeder did that. And there have been people who have reprehensibly shown support for him. But Roeder and his supporters do not accurately represent most people who call themselves “pro-lifers”. We need to ratchet down the rhetoric and the broad generalizations if we are to make any progress.

  29. fennec

    fennec said, 5 months ago

    ^which is basically what President Obama was trying to do at Notre Dame. Ratchet down the rhetoric, that is.

  30. Anthony 2816

    Anthony 2816Genius_badge said, 5 months ago

    Just once I’d like to see one of the anti-choicers say something about a women who has a dead 7-month fetus inside of her.

    Obviously she shouldn’t be allowed to have an abortion, right, anti-choicers? She should just risk her life to the chance of sepsis, in order to carry her dead fetus to term.

    Why do you hate this woman for wanting to get her dead fetus out right away? Why was someone who could have helped her murdered by one of your clinic protesters?

  31. stuperfan

    stuperfanGenius_badge said, 5 months ago

    Wow. Lots of comments on this one. Some with reasoned thought…others with the standard left or right reactions.

    Simply put though, the man who killed the doctor should be put in prison. The church and/or the oganizations which he, or the doctor, was involved with have little to do with the killers actions.

    Or are we soon going to see Mr. Carlson drawing a cartoon about the man who killed the Army recruiters?