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Simply log in and click on the ‘Favorite’ star directly above the strip. We believe this may give Mr. McEldowney and Pibgorn a head-start when it comes time for GoComics to decide which comics to keep, and which to lose.
“For extensive and in-depth background information, strip history, synopsis of story arcs, cast of characters and a short biography of the author of Pibgorn, see The Pibgorn Tribute Site:”
http://home.comcast.net/~ccdesan/Pibgorn/Pibgorn.html
“For extensive and in-depth background information, strip history, synopsis of story arcs, cast of characters, etc. for 9 Chickweed Lane, see The 9 Chickweed Lane Tribute Site:”
http://home.comcast.net/~ccdesan/Chickweed/Chickweed.html
These are unofficial sites created by one of our very own: CCDesan.
“For ‘How to Commit 3D,’ a page of quick-and-dirty description of how stereo images work and the rudiments of converting comics to 3D, visit:”
http://electronictiger.net/stereo/demo.htm
The 3D pages are created by another of our own, fairportfan.
“For the collected adventures of Joe Minotaur, based on the Pibgorn comic and a television police drama, visit:”
http://home.earthlink.net/~joeminotaur “Be sure to read the posts starting at the bottom of the page.”
Joe Minotaur is the creation of another of our own, Joe_Minotaur.
Come one and come all, de-lurk and join in!
Add your own voice to our great, joyous din!
Just one bit of wisdom ere joining our game:
Read the comments! All of them! Or you’ll miss something! (Shame!)
(No trolls need apply.)
I believe Spitcock is in some serious deep doo-doo when Dru finds him…but I don’t think he is going to have any power to “play” with, and I doubt that Dru will have any pity for him.
Goodnight all. I have imbibed too much Christmas wine tonight to keep my eyes open.
I infer that that’s the poltergeist piano since Dru retrieved Geoff’s original one she orbited–it was ruined by the temp/vacuum extremes. Assume she & Pib “bought” Geoff a new one on plastic.
CwL: Is Edda making a modified Gorgon face [courtesy of Gran, at least in part]? Gorgons were placed on all kinds of objects in classical times to ward off the evil eye–they were considered “apotropaic” magic.
http://tinyurl.com/7545te The protruding tongue was to avert impotence in particular, so Edda may be turning ill-wishes back on the challenger by asserting how much-of-a-muchness Amos has.
The piano…. I love it.
It just occurred to me that if there’s such a thing as a Jewish succubus, I wonder if at this time of the year she’d have a Dru-Del?
Hmmm, wonder why she never did give that piano back to our Geoff?
It calls the question: if she ever places a Violin up there…. would it be a StratoSpher-ius?
Survey completed yesterday and sent off snugly to W’Flower, and thanks a million to those who continue to guide me thru my newbie-ness.
I could get used to this couch.
L’Chaim,
MOE
Thanks much for the various links; especially those for Chickweed and Frazz: comics.com is being ultra-slow for me, and I’d given up on it. (I knew there had to be other Frazz fans around. Isn’t he great?)
And thanks for the link to info on apotropaic magic, poppysmatus. It’s over four decades since I took a folklore course, and I’d forgotten the term–if I ever absorbed it in the first place.
Hot biscuits, anybody?
Moe A. says:
The piano…. I love it.
It just occurred to me that if there’s such a thing as a Jewish succubus, I wonder if at this time of the year she’d have a Dru-Del?
I got curious and looked around –
found this – Lilith was cursed and turned into a succubus.
The Origin of Lilith:
Lilith has many origins. In one version of the bin-Sira version of the Bible, Lilith is the first wife of Adam (before Eve) and was created at the same time that god created Adam. In Greek myth, she is the goddess of the dark moon (Artemis is the goddess of the full moon, and Hecate is the goddess of the crescent moon). In Mesopotamian legends, Lilith is a fertility/earth goddess who protects people’s children and helps to harvest food. In both Arabic and Jewish myths however, she is a succubus. A demon-woman who hunts men, seduces them and drains their life with a kiss. Jewish mothers believed Lilith would come to take their children away and eat them.
Dru is looking for the Egg’s house, turn left at Locust, left again at Larding or Harding – it’s definitely in New York, since Geoff passed Seth and Edda in the streets.
Locust Point, Bronx
Locust Point, Bronx (a.k.a. Pirate Cove) is a small, peninsular neighborhood in the south eastern portion of the Borough. It is bounded by Harding Avenue on the north, the Throggs Neck Bridge to the east, and Eastchester Bay. The area is comprised of single-family houses, populated by ethnically Irish, German, and Italian families. A famous former resident of Locust Point is Michael Kay, the Yankees TV broadcaster on the YES Network and radio talk show host on 1050 ESPN radio. The Locust Point Yacht club occupies the outermost block before the bay.
Locust Point, Bronx used to be an island called Locust Island, however, the waterway that separated it from mainland Bronx was filled in and built upon. After it was no longer an island, its name was changed. Part of the landfill was for the bridge’s northern ramp and toll plaza.
wildflowerose warm thoughts for you and your daughter, hope all remains well!
feel the love…
MacF:Lilith as the first wife of Adam who refused to be subservient is coincident with the patriarchy usurping a very ancient matriarchal civilization, which I have tried to little avail to research…it’s a conspiracy!
the best part is that NASA doesn’t even question it. I remember when they found the piano, but i see they haven’t done anything about it.
wildflower: Thank God your daughter will be okay. we’ll keep you and her in our thoughts. too bad about the nurse, though.
MacF:Lilith as the first wife of Adam who refused to be subservient is coincident with the patriarchy usurping a very ancient matriarchal civilization, which I have tried to little avail to research…it’s a conspiracy!
Try looking at kabbalistic literature – I have Gershom Scholem’s book, Kabbalah, and he gives a whole chapter over to her.
txmystic says:
MacF: Lilith as the first wife of Adam who refused to be subservient is coincident with the patriarchy usurping a very ancient matriarchal civilization, which I have tried to little avail to research…it’s a conspiracy!*
txmystic- I have a book "When God was a Woman" that deals with female dieties from pre-history through the near present. And how Her position was changed or eliminated by Jews Greeks Romans and Christians, among others. Very research oriented, was probably the author’s doctoral thesis, or something. Not exactly light reading, but very interesting!*
wildflower; best wishes for you and your girl, may it be a truely happy holiday for ya’ll.
gg
“Dru is looking for the Egg’s house, turn left at Locust, left again at Larding or Harding – it’s definitely in New York, since Geoff passed Seth and Edda in the streets.”
Not to mention the Chrysler Building or a close approximation thereof being used to give a size comparison for LucZilla.
Excellent suggestions, thanks! most of my information comes from professional astrologers that I have met, but their focus is on the archetype itself, not so much any research into historical evidence of any matriarchal civilization…I’m worried that there was a wealth of such information (along with some really cool Greek plays) lost in the destruction of the Alexandrian library.
Joe Minotaur: Please may I quote your line “Nothing is more dangerous in the wrong hands than a grand piano.” at my favorite concert pianist (with full and proper attribution of course)?
pibfan868: Thank you for the snopes link - gave me a much-needed session of laughing out loud.
Thou denizens of the couch: With all your marvelous food postings, is there a Pib/Chickweed cookbook anywhere? (I did look but I’m a n00b so apologies if I missed it).
You know what would be neat!
We know how Dru, shall we say, recharges her power. When she finds Spinky, she should ‘make sure’ she has any that he might have left over. Then instead of killing him, just leave him drained and leave him to the mercy of the game.
Wild Flower – glad to hear your daughter will be well and fine soon, just needing a little care.
The story about the ER nurse – we lost one too, just a few weeks ago. It was unexpected, only in her early sixties, and a shock to us all. We have a memorial board up for her.
Best wishes to you and yours. Sometime soon today I will be making up a batch of Irish Cream. You’re certainly welcome to stop by the couch and have a nosh or two.
I have come to the conclusion that I am addicted to reading the Pibgorn Comments. I am utterly terrified of spiders. In a dream the other night, I saw one in my bathtub. Then I did something strange, even for a dream. I reached up into the air, plucked the byline from the previously posted comment, and applied it to the spider as one would a rolled up newspaper. My apologies fearciuil, I seem to recall the byline was yours. What a strange dream. Here’s a tissue incase you find some unidentified goop on your byline… (my bad!)
Impressive performance and superior tonal qualities makes the Yuan Qin a popular choice with students and teachers. Superior, clean workmanship and strict attention to detail produces a strong, sweet tone with easy playability.
As this is my first post to the Pibgorn conversation, I must say, I enjoy your banter. I, too, love this comic, while having only recently discovered it.
After reviewing the old cartoons with the rifle, I find it quite amazing at how much Mr. McEldowney’s artwork has progressed…. Not disparaging his earlier work by any means….
A fantastic saga of adventure both high and low, of forbidden passion and iambic pentameter, of fays, fools, organists, demons, accordions, heaven, hell and Shakespeare, Pibgorn follows the whims and flights of its eponymous fairy heroine as she plies her conviction that there must be more to life than depositing dew drops on dandelions and sleeping under mushrooms.
Comments (140) Jump to Comments Form
fear-ciuil said, 11 months ago
Don’t forget to ‘favorite’ the strip!
Simply log in and click on the ‘Favorite’ star directly above the strip. We believe this may give Mr. McEldowney and Pibgorn a head-start when it comes time for GoComics to decide which comics to keep, and which to lose.
“For extensive and in-depth background information, strip history, synopsis of story arcs, cast of characters and a short biography of the author of Pibgorn, see The Pibgorn Tribute Site:”
http://home.comcast.net/~ccdesan/Pibgorn/Pibgorn.html
“For info and a guide to special formatting on this forum (italic, bold, indents, large fonts, etc.), see The Pibgorn Style Guide:”
http://home.comcast.net/~ccdesan/Pibgorn/StyleGuide.html
“For extensive and in-depth background information, strip history, synopsis of story arcs, cast of characters, etc. for 9 Chickweed Lane, see The 9 Chickweed Lane Tribute Site:”
http://home.comcast.net/~ccdesan/Chickweed/Chickweed.html
These are unofficial sites created by one of our very own: CCDesan.
“For 3D converted versions of a couple of ‘Pibgorn’ panels, go to:”
http://electronictiger.net/stereo/dru.htm
“For ‘How to Commit 3D,’ a page of quick-and-dirty description of how stereo images work and the rudiments of converting comics to 3D, visit:”
http://electronictiger.net/stereo/demo.htm
The 3D pages are created by another of our own, fairportfan.
“For the collected adventures of Joe Minotaur, based on the Pibgorn comic and a television police drama, visit:”
http://home.earthlink.net/~joeminotaur
“Be sure to read the posts starting at the bottom of the page.”
Joe Minotaur is the creation of another of our own, Joe_Minotaur.
“For threaded discussion of all things Pibgorn and 9 Chickweed Lane, visit:”
http://www.talkaboutcomics.com/phpBB2/viewforum.php?f=568
“Yes, you have to register, and yes, it’s free.”
Come one and come all, de-lurk and join in!
Add your own voice to our great, joyous din!
Just one bit of wisdom ere joining our game:
Read the comments! All of them! Or you’ll miss something! (Shame!)
(No trolls need apply.)
9CWL:
http://www.chron.com/apps/comics/showComic.mpl?date=2008%2F12%2F22&name=9_Chickweed_Lane
Margueritem
said,
11 months ago
The Mojo lamp is where it belongs, with the piano, and the rifle. Very satisfying cartoon tonight.
Fairportfan said, 11 months ago
Posted at the tail-end of yesterday’s - reposting:
pibfan868 says:
“http://gprime.net/images/sidewalkchalkguy/
I just hit the stumble upon button on my tool bar, look at what it delivered to go along with this strip!”
Couple of years ago, i did a blog post about that guy: http://mog.com/fairportfan/blog/11618, which linked to his own page {http://users.skynet.be/J.Beever/pave.htm}, and to a page of amazing LEGO sculptures, including a LEGO version of several of M.C.Escher’s trick perspective paintings {http://www.andrewlipson.com/lego.htm - scroll down}.
Sisyphos said, 11 months ago
Why did he have to give her a note?! Anyway, good to see the orbital museum of succubistic mementoes.
Fly Guy
said,
11 months ago
Talk about asynchronisity, (sp) Pib didn’t get here till 12 after the hour.
Fairportfan said, 11 months ago
I missed the gun at first glimpse.
Fairportfan said, 11 months ago
I heard that, Miss Burber!
Sisyphos said, 11 months ago
fearciuil, the boilerplate should get a little reworking since Ranma_one_half has adopted Joe Minotaur as his screen name….
fear-ciuil said, 11 months ago
Sisyphos, good point. Done.
fieromike1945 said, 11 months ago
Instructions to ‘favorite’ the strip would also be helpful…
The Old Wolf
said,
11 months ago
Reposted from “yesterday”: The Borgia Cantus ought to be floating around up there somewhere…
@fieromike1945: Just click the little star above the strip…
emjrn said, 11 months ago
I believe Spitcock is in some serious deep doo-doo when Dru finds him…but I don’t think he is going to have any power to “play” with, and I doubt that Dru will have any pity for him.
Goodnight all. I have imbibed too much Christmas wine tonight to keep my eyes open.
fear-ciuil said, 11 months ago
fieromike1945, I see ccdesan beat me to it, but the instructions have now been added.
debra4life50 said, 11 months ago
Forgive my ignorance, but what story arc is the rifle from?
fear-ciuil said, 11 months ago
debra4life50 said:
Forgive my ignorance, but what story arc is the rifle from?
It’s from the very first story arc, “The Girl in the Coffee Cup.” Specifically:
http://picayune.uclick.com/comics/pib/2002/pib020608.gif
http://picayune.uclick.com/comics/pib/2002/pib020610.gif
http://picayune.uclick.com/comics/pib/2002/pib020611.gif
http://picayune.uclick.com/comics/pib/2002/pib020612.gif
http://picayune.uclick.com/comics/pib/2002/pib020613.gif
http://picayune.uclick.com/comics/pib/2002/pib020614.gif
http://picayune.uclick.com/comics/pib/2002/pib020615.gif
Sisyphos said, 11 months ago
Upon looking over those “hunter” strips, I am moved to ask, when did Dru stop wearing eye shadow?
Fairportfan said, 11 months ago
Sisyphos says:
“Upon looking over those ‘hunter’ strips, I am moved to ask, when did Dru stop wearing eye shadow?”
Bunno - but when did Pib’s pupils stop disappearing when she was stressed or surprised?
Lampblack
said,
11 months ago
No more storing mojo in the lamp. How cool is that?
Joe Minotaur said, 11 months ago
Sisyphos and fearciuil:
Thanks for the re-crediting on the boilerplate. I was going to bring it up if it didn’t happen tonight.
9CWL: Now we know the name of little Ms. Troublemaker. Is Ms. Yuan a real person? If so, Amos may get Fan Mail, she will get Flame Mail.
Pibgorn:
Doesn’t Dru have “OnStar”? Nice collection. Nothing is more dangerous in the wrong hands than a grand piano.
OldPossum said, 11 months ago
pibfan868 says:
“http://gprime.net/images/sidewalkchalkguy/
I just hit the stumble upon button on my tool bar, look at what it delivered to go along with this strip!”
Hey, Luciano!
The Old Wolf
said,
11 months ago
If you want some good Hanukkah humor, check today’s Frazz: http://comics.com/frazz/
PdLorinel said, 11 months ago
In all the centuries Dru’s been around, there are only three mementos in orbit from people who have tried to kill her?
And all of them from the last few years.
It has to be a side effect of allowing herself to fall in love. Greater passion in all walks of life.
ejcapulet
said,
11 months ago
I almost forgot what happened to that piano.
Anyol'tomcat
said,
11 months ago
I infer that that’s the poltergeist piano since Dru retrieved Geoff’s original one she orbited–it was ruined by the temp/vacuum extremes. Assume she & Pib “bought” Geoff a new one on plastic.
CwL: Is Edda making a modified Gorgon face [courtesy of Gran, at least in part]? Gorgons were placed on all kinds of objects in classical times to ward off the evil eye–they were considered “apotropaic” magic.
http://tinyurl.com/7545te
The protruding tongue was to avert impotence in particular, so Edda may be turning ill-wishes back on the challenger by asserting how much-of-a-muchness Amos has.
Bill Wa said, 11 months ago
I remember when she sent the gun and the piano into orbit.
Moe A. said, 11 months ago
The piano…. I love it.
It just occurred to me that if there’s such a thing as a Jewish succubus, I wonder if at this time of the year she’d have a Dru-Del?
Hmmm, wonder why she never did give that piano back to our Geoff?
It calls the question: if she ever places a Violin up there…. would it be a StratoSpher-ius?
Survey completed yesterday and sent off snugly to W’Flower, and thanks a million to those who continue to guide me thru my newbie-ness.
I could get used to this couch.
L’Chaim,
MOE
atajayhawk said, 11 months ago
Thanks much for the various links; especially those for Chickweed and Frazz: comics.com is being ultra-slow for me, and I’d given up on it. (I knew there had to be other Frazz fans around. Isn’t he great?)
And thanks for the link to info on apotropaic magic, poppysmatus. It’s over four decades since I took a folklore course, and I’d forgotten the term–if I ever absorbed it in the first place.
Hot biscuits, anybody?
macFicheallaigh said, 11 months ago
Moe A. says:
The piano…. I love it.
It just occurred to me that if there’s such a thing as a Jewish succubus, I wonder if at this time of the year she’d have a Dru-Del?
I got curious and looked around –
found this – Lilith was cursed and turned into a succubus.
http://www.lilithgallery.com/library/
The Origin of Lilith:
Lilith has many origins. In one version of the bin-Sira version of the Bible, Lilith is the first wife of Adam (before Eve) and was created at the same time that god created Adam. In Greek myth, she is the goddess of the dark moon (Artemis is the goddess of the full moon, and Hecate is the goddess of the crescent moon). In Mesopotamian legends, Lilith is a fertility/earth goddess who protects people’s children and helps to harvest food. In both Arabic and Jewish myths however, she is a succubus. A demon-woman who hunts men, seduces them and drains their life with a kiss. Jewish mothers believed Lilith would come to take their children away and eat them.
Poms
said,
11 months ago
Happy Morning
Unable to stay and chat today. I will continue to lurk to keep up on the poems and parodies.
Wildflowerose - my thoughts are with you and your daughter. Prayers and hopes for a speedy recovery and healing!
There is a real support group here on the couch and you will find it comforting to know that these “strangers” actually do care.
macFicheallaigh said, 11 months ago
Dru is looking for the Egg’s house, turn left at Locust, left again at Larding or Harding – it’s definitely in New York, since Geoff passed Seth and Edda in the streets.
Check this out:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LocustPoint,Bronx
Locust Point, Bronx
Locust Point, Bronx (a.k.a. Pirate Cove) is a small, peninsular neighborhood in the south eastern portion of the Borough. It is bounded by Harding Avenue on the north, the Throggs Neck Bridge to the east, and Eastchester Bay. The area is comprised of single-family houses, populated by ethnically Irish, German, and Italian families. A famous former resident of Locust Point is Michael Kay, the Yankees TV broadcaster on the YES Network and radio talk show host on 1050 ESPN radio. The Locust Point Yacht club occupies the outermost block before the bay.
Locust Point, Bronx used to be an island called Locust Island, however, the waterway that separated it from mainland Bronx was filled in and built upon. After it was no longer an island, its name was changed. Part of the landfill was for the bridge’s northern ramp and toll plaza.
kcboomer
said,
11 months ago
I guess Pib ought to get Dru a Garmin for Xmas.
pibfan868
said,
11 months ago
http://www.snopes.com/holidays/christmas/humor/mondegreens.asp
A little Christmas related humor for you all–more later!
txmystic
said,
11 months ago
wildflowerose warm thoughts for you and your daughter, hope all remains well!
feel the love…
MacF:Lilith as the first wife of Adam who refused to be subservient is coincident with the patriarchy usurping a very ancient matriarchal civilization, which I have tried to little avail to research…it’s a conspiracy!
Simon_Jester said, 11 months ago
Whoa…with those fangs put away, Dru looks hotter than ever in that new color scheme.
Pokefan_Frank said, 11 months ago
I was wondering when we’d see that piano again :-D
maeverin said, 11 months ago
the best part is that NASA doesn’t even question it. I remember when they found the piano, but i see they haven’t done anything about it.
wildflower:
Thank God your daughter will be okay. we’ll keep you and her in our thoughts. too bad about the nurse, though.
macFicheallaigh said, 11 months ago
txmystic says:
MacF:Lilith as the first wife of Adam who refused to be subservient is coincident with the patriarchy usurping a very ancient matriarchal civilization, which I have tried to little avail to research…it’s a conspiracy!
Try looking at kabbalistic literature – I have Gershom Scholem’s book, Kabbalah, and he gives a whole chapter over to her.
gg015879
said,
11 months ago
txmystic says:
MacF: Lilith as the first wife of Adam who refused to be subservient is coincident with the patriarchy usurping a very ancient matriarchal civilization, which I have tried to little avail to research…it’s a conspiracy!*
txmystic- I have a book "When God was a Woman" that deals with female dieties from pre-history through the near present. And how Her position was changed or eliminated by Jews Greeks Romans and Christians, among others. Very research oriented, was probably the author’s doctoral thesis, or something. Not exactly light reading, but very interesting!*
wildflower; best wishes for you and your girl, may it be a truely happy holiday for ya’ll.
gg
Fairportfan said, 11 months ago
macFicheallaigh says:
“Dru is looking for the Egg’s house, turn left at Locust, left again at Larding or Harding – it’s definitely in New York, since Geoff passed Seth and Edda in the streets.”
Not to mention the Chrysler Building or a close approximation thereof being used to give a size comparison for LucZilla.
jml58 said, 11 months ago
Let´s hope her souvenirs don´t collide with the ISS.
txmystic
said,
11 months ago
MacF, gg:
Excellent suggestions, thanks! most of my information comes from professional astrologers that I have met, but their focus is on the archetype itself, not so much any research into historical evidence of any matriarchal civilization…I’m worried that there was a wealth of such information (along with some really cool Greek plays) lost in the destruction of the Alexandrian library.
KalahariNight
said,
11 months ago
Joe Minotaur: Please may I quote your line “Nothing is more dangerous in the wrong hands than a grand piano.” at my favorite concert pianist (with full and proper attribution of course)?
pibfan868: Thank you for the snopes link - gave me a much-needed session of laughing out loud.
Thou denizens of the couch: With all your marvelous food postings, is there a Pib/Chickweed cookbook anywhere? (I did look but I’m a n00b so apologies if I missed it).
Happy Holidays all!
OldSooner said, 11 months ago
You know what would be neat!
We know how Dru, shall we say, recharges her power. When she finds Spinky, she should ‘make sure’ she has any that he might have left over. Then instead of killing him, just leave him drained and leave him to the mercy of the game.
TiggerLeBounce said, 11 months ago
I haven’t seen any Pibby cookbooks, KalahariNight. But I’ve collected a few recipes that I’m always willing to share!
macFicheallaigh said, 11 months ago
Wild Flower – glad to hear your daughter will be well and fine soon, just needing a little care.
The story about the ER nurse – we lost one too, just a few weeks ago. It was unexpected, only in her early sixties, and a shock to us all. We have a memorial board up for her.
Best wishes to you and yours. Sometime soon today I will be making up a batch of Irish Cream. You’re certainly welcome to stop by the couch and have a nosh or two.
Olliebird said, 11 months ago
Wildflowerrose
Hope your daughter if feeling better. Our prayers to keep you safe.
Jinxkitty said, 11 months ago
I have come to the conclusion that I am addicted to reading the Pibgorn Comments. I am utterly terrified of spiders. In a dream the other night, I saw one in my bathtub. Then I did something strange, even for a dream. I reached up into the air, plucked the byline from the previously posted comment, and applied it to the spider as one would a rolled up newspaper. My apologies fearciuil, I seem to recall the byline was yours. What a strange dream. Here’s a tissue incase you find some unidentified goop on your byline… (my bad!)
gg015879
said,
11 months ago
a quick google of Yuan Cello turned up this*
Impressive performance and superior tonal qualities makes the Yuan Qin a popular choice with students and teachers. Superior, clean workmanship and strict attention to detail produces a strong, sweet tone with easy playability.
http://www.swstrings.com/catalog/showInstrumentGroup.jsp?groupId=855&subcategory=Cello
just FYI for anyone interested
gg
fatuncle
said,
11 months ago
TiggerLeBounce; KalahariNight:
I think a Pibgorn cookbook would be a great idea. I would cheerfully hang a couple of recipes on that wall.
He_Stole_My_Cigars said, 11 months ago
As this is my first post to the Pibgorn conversation, I must say, I enjoy your banter. I, too, love this comic, while having only recently discovered it.
After reviewing the old cartoons with the rifle, I find it quite amazing at how much Mr. McEldowney’s artwork has progressed…. Not disparaging his earlier work by any means….