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Excellent cartoon comrade. Commissar Obama and the state-run media will be pleased to publish this. Did you get your funding from the people’s National Endowment for State-Sanctioned Art?
It is interesting that a group of people that is looking at the long term problems Obama is generating is being compared to racists, Nazi’s and hillbillies.
All the while Caucasians are being called racial slurs, hurt, robbed and killed the inner cities.
The whole gang problem is growing at an alarming rate with murder and drugs at all time high.
The democrats are up to 50 million babies killed through abortion.
The national debt is at an all time high.
Obama and the democrats are close to bankrupting the nation in only 9 months.
But, people whom have jobs, pay taxes and want the best for the country are Nazi’s and racist.
It’s all about racism, wanting to make it ok to advocate a violent act against our president. Don’t tell me this extremism would be going on if Obama was a WASP.
still waiting for a responsible GOP leader to denounce this element … still waiting for those who speak at the tea party meetings to get on stage and say get rid of those signs, that’s NOT what we’re about … still waiting for responsible GOP to do more than criticize the media messengers for reporting what is right before their eyes.
Sorry, folks. But there are actual racists in this country. And here’s a news flash. Not a one of them thinks he or she is a racist.
As usual, I agree with believecommonsense. Conservative leaders need to get out in front and call out the racists and extremists among them. If you don’t think they exist in the crowds of protesters, then you’re naive.
And liberal leaders also need to step up to the microphone and call out those among them who charge that any critic of the President is a racist.
ALL liberals are racists, though. That’s the problem. They view humanity through the lens of identity politics. THEY support and craft all the endless racist laws which divide people up by “race”, gender, etc
The Christian worldview works much better. Where there is only ONE race, the human race–all descended from Adam and Eve, all created in the image of God–and where at worst people could then squabble about gender differences (nothing else, since “sexual orientation” is a fictional term, and “ethnicity” matters not at all, since God measures all people by the same standards).
The Darwinist “evolutionary’ worldview is where humans get divided up into different “races” based solely on physical appearance. Ignoring the fact that all humans can experience the same emotions, passions, thoughts, etc based on their own free wil choices…
I’m pleased that by God’s grace I am a Christian, not a racist.
You were asking Scott if Obama should be hurt.
My answer is no. If he is you will see who the real racists are.
According to most African Americans if it happens the dividing line is going straight down the middle.
In other words if you are white and not prejudice the punishment will be the same as you were.
All the ditches will be full of dead bodies.
Being harmed is already built into the fabric of the universe. Obama’s own free-will choices will thus do him all the harm that is needed, without anyone else lifting a finger
Obviously I do not advocate any human being physically harming Obama. What would be the point? What would change for the better? Just the opposite would happen: Obama would become a political martyr.
Also, again, it is obvious that nowhere in the New Testament are there any passages which would in any way suggest that anyone should physically harm Obama.
“Do not be deceived; God cannot be mocked. A man always reaps what he sows..”
OK, to clarify my question, I will ask all of you and not just Scott, do you think Obama or for that matter, any politician should be harmed and if not, can you ackowledge that all the rhetoric, the carrying guns to public events, the calling Obama “Hitler” or “faciest” or “he is the antichrist”, might possibly inflame some to a violent attempt on Obama’s life? This is my great concern.Because I remember vividly the assasination of JFK, RFK and MLK I am quite sensitive to this terrible possibility.
^ Of course no one should be harmed, even politicians.
From afar I’m getting the impression that an environment is being created where the usually suppressed hatred is being allowed to surface unchallenged and more importantly, that it is being condoned instead of being condemned.
From there it can be a short step to actually carrying out the harm one would like to inflict. But similarly I also had the impression that the atmosphere against GWBush was such that the hatred felt against him could also have easily led to an attempt on his life. As it happened, just a couple of shoes were thrown at him and not even by an American national.
The obviously racist should be called out but care must be taken in not tarring everyone who is opposed to Obama with the same brush.
However, I also get the impression that valid criticism is being taken out of context and claimed to being applied to all.
Deadhead - To answer your question we must start with Cain and Abel. Move on to Egyptians and Jews. Etc, Etc. There always has been hatred in the world, man vs man, cause vs cause, sometimes based on race, sometimes on religion, sometimes on politial ideals, sometimes just on personal or family contact (Romeo and Juliet?) You are proposing that our rights of free speech and our rights to assemble should be revoked. I cannot support that. Can sick minds be controlled? I donot think that silencing the general population to opposing Mr Obama will change his skin pigmentation to be acceptable to someone whose heart is racist. Do NOT deny my rights because of a few demented minds.
Fennec…So you are saying that Bush and Cheney did something bad enough for you that they should have been harmed? Or are you trying to be clever? Are you for the death penalty?
Deadheadzan…Were YOU distressed when people were talking about harming President Bush and writing books about doing harm to him? If you weren’t you are a hypocrite and you are obsessing to the point that you appear to be wishing for something to happen so the Right can be blamed and harmed in the next election cycle.
Let me be personally clear, I do not agree with most of Obama’s policies nor do I respect his run up through the Chicago machine and his limited experience at running anything. I do not wish him or any politician harm and I don’t care if Obama is Purple, Green, or whatever. It means nothing to me.
There have been some great posts and I do appreciate the recent one by omQ R. It was very poignent and objective.
I am going to deal with this one the same way I always deal with closed minded bigots. Yawn Britt, nothing to see here. The best way to deal with a bigot is just like a troll. Do not feed and do not take the bait.
fennec. thanks for the article, I hadn’t read it yet. I too like reading Brooks’ commentary.
winfield, I’ll just share that I refused to watch the movie about a fictional assassination attempt on Bush, even when it was shown on TV. I don’t find any entertainment or amusement about assassinations, having lived through too man y in my lifetime. I also think Beck should have been reprimanded for his sick joke about assassinating Pelosi via poison in her wine. Did you object to that?
BCS…I honestly didn’t hear Beck’s comment or hear about it. If he said it I don’t agree with it, but it is not mine or the publics job to handle HR issues for other companies (maybe he was reprimanded). I have worked in customer service and have had many situations where customers have demanded to know how I or my company handled a situation they didn’t like (it was none of their business).
I don’t pay that much attention to the screamers on either side of the aisle. Beck, Olberman, Maddow, Hannity, etc all sing the same tune over and over.
scott, you are totally incorrect, and the nature of your ignorance merely proves the point. Biologically, humans don’t have races. It’s a meaningless term. And Darwinist geneticists and biologists established that. So don’t try to draw the stupid link between Darwinism and Nazism, like Ben Stein did. It’s wrong, get it?
In fairness, there are those conservitives who oppose the presidnet on principal. But even they are racists if they don’t admit it. Racism comes wih what ever color skin you have.
Yeah Motive, just ignore all of History and present-day reality and claim no one thinks human beings have different races, or makes decisions based on that precept.
It’s so meaningless that every domestic policy the US government makes is first and foremost predicated on race. So meaningless that our entire society has been forcibly altered by the US government to make us more racially “diverse”. (as if each and every human being isn’t already an individual; nope, gotta go by skin color etc).
Darwinist biologists are the ones who during Darwin’s lifetime hunted down and murdered 1000s of Aborigines in Australia because they regarded them as being apes–missing links.
Hitler and his cronies quoted Darwinism at great length, using it as their inspiration for creating a Master Race etc
You can lie, lie, all you want, dude. You don’t fool me, you don’t fool God, I doubt you even fool your own cold, hard heart…
“These six things doth the LORD hate: yea, seven are an abomination unto him: A proud look, a lying tongue, and hands that shed innocent blood, An heart that deviseth wicked imaginations, feet that be swift in running to mischief, A false witness that speaketh lies, and he that soweth discord among brethren.” (Proverbs 6:16-19).
i can’t tell if you’re lying or just wrong-minded, but i do know that racist right leaning religious pundits sow discord among people.
Well, in all honesty, there are left-wing pundits doing pretty much the same. I have to agree in this case, though - stirring the public with exaggerations and lies about death panels, spurious Nazi comparisons, etc, is wrong. It was wrong during the Bush years, too - although imo Bush was definitely closer, and got a much better end than he deserved, but that’s another story.
Libs suck. We all know it. And they know it, too. That’s why more than 63% of people polled said they were “conservative”, 25% or less said they were “liberal”. Lot of support there.
Whose study, PO? Write a study that differentiates between registered Dems/Repubs/Libertarians and then I’ll be impressed since poll numbers don’t support yours’ at all in terms of either voter turnout or party registration.
Doesn’t change the numbers PO. My comment was about elections (Pro-Dem) and registration numbers (Increasing Dems and Independants) contrary to your’ “Conservative” study.
The point being that surveys reflect what you want them to if worded properly :-)
scott, try to read, okay? I said biologically humans don’t have races. Of course I know that people think they exist, and idiots of all stripes are still trying to prove they do (e.g., The Bell Curve).
Darwin was against slavery, and this actually helped propel his theory of evolution.
He cannot be held responsible for those who misused, misunderstood, or simply screwed up his theory. “Social Darwinism” was an abomination that was utterly unsupported by Darwinist theory. And Hitler’s nonsense – unfortunately inspired by a number of American pseudoscientists – was not Darwinist, either.
I don’t accept your judgment on God’s feelings about me, either. You’re not entitled to offer any.
Considering that my “cold, hard heart” is apparently more empathic towards my fellow beings than yours (that’s what liberalism and feminism is all about, dude), I wonder what temperature yours is at? Liquid oxygen?
I find it amusing to read the anguish, despair and utter helplessness of liberals trying to discredit The Bell Curve. Beautifully written, thoroughly researched and totally logical.
For those who haven’t actually read it, Herrnstein says there is a direct correlation between intelligence and success. Shock! How can that be?
That seems so obvious why do liberals oppose those conclusions? Because the people in this country who have achieved success have certain ethnic backgrounds that don’t coincide with PC views. If we accept the correlation that would imply differences between the races. And that would be depressing.
The dogmas of the quiet past are inadequate to the stormy present. The occasion is pile high with difficulty, and we must rise with the occasion. As our case is new, so we must think anew. We must disenthrall ourselves. LINCOLN
GNWack-o says: “For those who haven’t actually read it, Herrnstein says there is a direct correlation between intelligence and success. Shock! How can that be?”
DrCanuck elaborates: Few would ever find a problem with that correlation. Unfortunately, that’s not all Murray and Herrnstein say. They then go on to find correlations between race and intelligence, which is where people have problems. And being “politically correct” has nothing to do with it.
Trust Wack-o to purposefully misrepresent an idea to push his agenda.
GNWachs, I’m an authority on assessment worldwide, with a Ph.D in personality psychology. I am not an amateur. The Bell Curve is both nonscientific (they didn’t dare go through peer review) and thoroughly political in nature, not “well-researched” and “totally logical.” Indeed you can accept all their points and still come up with a different logical conclusion.
Meta-analyses by respected researchers like Hunter & Schmidt indicate that IQ accounts for about 20-25% of variation in job success. Emotional Intelligence, by contrast, is closer to 45%. This is particularly true at senior levels in organizations. (I’ve spoken to Frank Schmidt myself, who agrees that at executive levels IQ probably quits differentiating between good and great performance - they’re already pretty smart [ about 115 IQ], but that isn’t enough, and you get restriction of range.)
The Bell Curve is indeed well written. It had to be. If you read carefully, you will find that their conclusions actually conflict with some of their data.
Furthermore, some of their research has in fact failed to deliver. For example, the twin studies some people love to point to are nowhere near as compelling as believed. It turns out that twins adopted by separate couples tend to be adopted by extraordinarily similar people which means the environmental factors are too.
Furthermore, geneticists will tell you (fennec? you’re a biologist) that races are pure fiction! The overlap between gene pools is overwhelming. (Especially in the US, incidentally, where most African-Americans of slave descent are about half European-American ancestry. Make of that what you will.)
Read a few of the scientists countering it, e.g., Stephen Jay Gould’s Mismeasure of Man, or The Bell Curve Debate (ed. Jacoby and Glauberman).
Here’s that 5-page paper (by me) again now with page numbers as it was just published in the Proceedings of the Royal Society of London. It uses Jensen’s method of correlated vectors and finds that East Asian-European-South Asian-Colored-African differences on the Raven’s items are all more pronounced on the more heritable ones.
If the Royal Society says group differences are partly heritable, that’s as official as it gets in my book!
Best, Phil
February–March 2005 ● American Psychologist 149
Copyright 2005 by the American Psychological Association 0003-066X/05/$12.00
Vol. 60, No. 2, 149–160 DOI: 10.1037/0003-066X.60.2.149
Go to Linda’s vita–lots of great articles on race and IQ. She’s fearless.
From:”Linda Gottfredson”
Subject:Re: paper
To:
Dear Bob,
Thank you for sending your paper, as Ray suggested you might. If you are
able to download papers from the internet, you can get any of mine from my
e-vita. Some might be of interest for your present project.
http://www.udel.edu/educ/gottfredson/reprints/
Thanks for the references, GNW. I see Gottfredson’s an advocate for the “g” factor. I am not, as it happens; I’m firmly on the side of multiple intelligences based on my own work in business (which unfortunately precludes publishing much of it due to client restrictions). Much interesting recent neurobiological work appears to support my view, but it’s certainly not completely decided yet. I’ll take a look at her.
As for Rushton, but frankly he’s more than a little dubious as regards his research, even though his academic credentials are sterling. There’s quite a bit of discussion regarding his work in The Bell Curve Debate, including his “penis vs. brain” theory, which is more than a little strange, claiming that you can have one or the other but not both, and ordering Asians, Caucasians, and Africans along the axis from brain to penis. Even leaving out the Darwinian errors in this, as one researcher pointed out, a better measure of sexuality is probably the size of the scrotum, not the mere pipe of delivery. He’s also done some unapproved work (violating standard procedures for ethical standards) for which he was rightly disciplined by his university.
When it comes to health care and medicine, Pharmacy, Big Pharma, pharmacology etc I have done the required study and spent the time. Obviously, your background and research lies in the fields above. I in no way able to debate your expertise in this field.
But one of my dearest friends is both a PhD in the field, a retired tenured professor from my alma mater the U of I and how he teaches at NYU.
The subject is of great interest to me and I wrote him about it last month. I sent his answers to you above. That is how I was able to reply so quickly. We have held many discussions on the subject. Literally Thursday night was the last. Humorously he described “liberal creationism”.
And so, to summarize this huge amount of info on the Bell Curve:
There is no such thing as race, so after careful research and precise writing, Murray and Herrnstein have come to the conclusion that some people are more or less intelligent than others.
GNW - did you read all the way to the bottom, about Rushton’s associations? Anyone who funds an organization that starts with the assumption that blacks are “dangerous” and that white people need to protect their genes is likely to find that what they are looking for in their research…
I’m rushing out the door today so can’t dedicate the time this deserves (e.g., the work on brain size has traditionally been massively contaminated by body size and shape - but haven’t checked out this stuff), but there’s one massive, overwhelmingly important assumption that Rushton, et al., are making: That IQ measures intelligence, and secondarily that “intelligence” is a unitary thing (the latter is known as the g factor). This is by no means proven, though I know others will disagree with me on this; but recent neuropsychological studies and plenty of other kinds of research do suggest otherwise. If instead IQ measures a certain kind of paper-and-pencil (or web-based) problem-solving intelligence, then all their theories come tumbling down, and we replace it with a different approach, which is to identify which gene pools might have advantages in one category of intelligence over another. See, for example, Howard Gardners Frames of Mind for a very accessible description of multiple intelligences.
And I’ve found that analytical (cause-and-effect, chains of reasoning) thinking and conceptual (recognition of patterns, simplifying complex information) don’t correlate, and this is solid enough to separate the measures for managerial assessment!
If there is no such thing as “race” who exactly are the beneficiaries of Affirmative Action? When one competes the college application that box must be checked off. This is an example of when it helps liberals there is such a thing as race.
If there is no such thing as “race” who exactly is the Justice Department protecting when they don’t allow cities and states to change district boundary lines before elections. It might harm some (group?) Another example of if it helps liberals than there is such a thing as race.
If there is no such thing as race who are the beneficiaries of laws designed to stop DWB. Driving while black in which state police stop some groups more than others. Another example of if it helps liberals there is such a thing as race.
AAMOF, the only time there is no such thing as race is when it comes to IQ tests, then the concept of race doesn’t exist.
Naturally liberals don’t believe in g. Because if there was such a thing everything we call discriminatory would fall neatly into place. It would solve the hundreds of impossible to answer questions about difference in success rates. We could forget about AA and instead concentrate on education.
We say we believe in evolution and therefore different homo sapiens evolved differently. Pygmies, giants, black skin, white skin, redskin etc etc. the only place there was no evolution is in general intelligence.
church, I’ve described Beck’s performance re Pelosi as a sick joke and I fully condemn it. I don’t think making jokes about assassinating anyone is funny, nor appropriate and I condemn it. The position of speaker of the house is third in line for the presidency. I don’t give a durn what you think of the person who currently holds the office, assassination jokes are appalling.
Sophomoric is too kind, Beck is deranged but he sure is having fun and making money.
wminfield and I had a dialogue elsewhere on this site and I told him I equally condemn the movie made about a fictional assassination of Bush. I condemn all assassination jokes. Period.
And I’ve heard of media matters, of course, but don’t go to the site. I’ve stated repeatedly I like getting “news” and “facts.” Unlike you, I don’t seek sources that will conform to my preconceived and uninformed notions.
A self-described liberal, award-winning editorial cartoonist Chris Britt nevertheless delights in skewering deserving politicians of every persuasion. Britt's sardonic, biting cartoons are sometimes controversial, often outrageous and always thought-provoking.
Comments (56) Jump to Comments Form
tjanus said, 2 months ago
Excellent cartoon comrade. Commissar Obama and the state-run media will be pleased to publish this. Did you get your funding from the people’s National Endowment for State-Sanctioned Art?
treered said, 2 months ago
the cartoon is WRONG! Obama is the one who said this is not about racism. the eternal optimist…
striper77 said, 2 months ago
It is interesting that a group of people that is looking at the long term problems Obama is generating is being compared to racists, Nazi’s and hillbillies.
All the while Caucasians are being called racial slurs, hurt, robbed and killed the inner cities.
The whole gang problem is growing at an alarming rate with murder and drugs at all time high.
The democrats are up to 50 million babies killed through abortion.
The national debt is at an all time high.
Obama and the democrats are close to bankrupting the nation in only 9 months.
But, people whom have jobs, pay taxes and want the best for the country are Nazi’s and racist.
More Obama change.
deadheadzan
said,
2 months ago
It’s all about racism, wanting to make it ok to advocate a violent act against our president. Don’t tell me this extremism would be going on if Obama was a WASP.
believecommonsense
said,
2 months ago
still waiting for a responsible GOP leader to denounce this element … still waiting for those who speak at the tea party meetings to get on stage and say get rid of those signs, that’s NOT what we’re about … still waiting for responsible GOP to do more than criticize the media messengers for reporting what is right before their eyes.
tpenna
said,
2 months ago
Sorry, folks. But there are actual racists in this country. And here’s a news flash. Not a one of them thinks he or she is a racist.
As usual, I agree with believecommonsense. Conservative leaders need to get out in front and call out the racists and extremists among them. If you don’t think they exist in the crowds of protesters, then you’re naive.
And liberal leaders also need to step up to the microphone and call out those among them who charge that any critic of the President is a racist.
scottfreitas
said,
2 months ago
ALL liberals are racists, though. That’s the problem. They view humanity through the lens of identity politics. THEY support and craft all the endless racist laws which divide people up by “race”, gender, etc
The Christian worldview works much better. Where there is only ONE race, the human race–all descended from Adam and Eve, all created in the image of God–and where at worst people could then squabble about gender differences (nothing else, since “sexual orientation” is a fictional term, and “ethnicity” matters not at all, since God measures all people by the same standards).
The Darwinist “evolutionary’ worldview is where humans get divided up into different “races” based solely on physical appearance. Ignoring the fact that all humans can experience the same emotions, passions, thoughts, etc based on their own free wil choices…
I’m pleased that by God’s grace I am a Christian, not a racist.
HUMPHRIES
said,
2 months ago
scott from the way you post - whose God ?
deadheadzan
said,
2 months ago
scott, what’s your view on Obama? Do you think he should be harmed?
striper77 said, 2 months ago
You were asking Scott if Obama should be hurt.
My answer is no. If he is you will see who the real racists are.
According to most African Americans if it happens the dividing line is going straight down the middle.
In other words if you are white and not prejudice the punishment will be the same as you were.
All the ditches will be full of dead bodies.
Here is another Obama change.
Who will win? In the end no one.
scottfreitas
said,
2 months ago
@ deadhead: why would you even ask me that?
Being harmed is already built into the fabric of the universe. Obama’s own free-will choices will thus do him all the harm that is needed, without anyone else lifting a finger
Obviously I do not advocate any human being physically harming Obama. What would be the point? What would change for the better? Just the opposite would happen: Obama would become a political martyr.
Also, again, it is obvious that nowhere in the New Testament are there any passages which would in any way suggest that anyone should physically harm Obama.
“Do not be deceived; God cannot be mocked. A man always reaps what he sows..”
deadheadzan
said,
2 months ago
OK, to clarify my question, I will ask all of you and not just Scott, do you think Obama or for that matter, any politician should be harmed and if not, can you ackowledge that all the rhetoric, the carrying guns to public events, the calling Obama “Hitler” or “faciest” or “he is the antichrist”, might possibly inflame some to a violent attempt on Obama’s life? This is my great concern.Because I remember vividly the assasination of JFK, RFK and MLK I am quite sensitive to this terrible possibility.
omQ R
said,
2 months ago
^ Of course no one should be harmed, even politicians.
From afar I’m getting the impression that an environment is being created where the usually suppressed hatred is being allowed to surface unchallenged and more importantly, that it is being condoned instead of being condemned.
From there it can be a short step to actually carrying out the harm one would like to inflict. But similarly I also had the impression that the atmosphere against GWBush was such that the hatred felt against him could also have easily led to an attempt on his life. As it happened, just a couple of shoes were thrown at him and not even by an American national.
The obviously racist should be called out but care must be taken in not tarring everyone who is opposed to Obama with the same brush.
However, I also get the impression that valid criticism is being taken out of context and claimed to being applied to all.
Loco80 said, 2 months ago
Deadhead - To answer your question we must start with Cain and Abel. Move on to Egyptians and Jews. Etc, Etc. There always has been hatred in the world, man vs man, cause vs cause, sometimes based on race, sometimes on religion, sometimes on politial ideals, sometimes just on personal or family contact (Romeo and Juliet?) You are proposing that our rights of free speech and our rights to assemble should be revoked. I cannot support that. Can sick minds be controlled? I donot think that silencing the general population to opposing Mr Obama will change his skin pigmentation to be acceptable to someone whose heart is racist. Do NOT deny my rights because of a few demented minds.
HOWGOZIT said, 2 months ago
You won’t find them reading your DNC notes BCS.
believecommonsense
said,
2 months ago
Howie, huh?
believecommonsense
said,
2 months ago
omQR, that’s a fair recap of situation and a good post.
NoFearPup
said,
2 months ago
I wonder why Bush was fair game, but Obama is off limits?
fennec said, 2 months ago
Maybe because Bush/Cheney went waaay past any limits reasonable to the republic???
BTW, a conservative take that strikes me as being reasonable (even tho’ I’m a liberal!):
http://www.nytimes.com/2009/09/18/opinion/18brooks.html?_r=1&ref=global
wminfield
said,
2 months ago
Fennec…So you are saying that Bush and Cheney did something bad enough for you that they should have been harmed? Or are you trying to be clever? Are you for the death penalty?
Deadheadzan…Were YOU distressed when people were talking about harming President Bush and writing books about doing harm to him? If you weren’t you are a hypocrite and you are obsessing to the point that you appear to be wishing for something to happen so the Right can be blamed and harmed in the next election cycle.
Let me be personally clear, I do not agree with most of Obama’s policies nor do I respect his run up through the Chicago machine and his limited experience at running anything. I do not wish him or any politician harm and I don’t care if Obama is Purple, Green, or whatever. It means nothing to me.
There have been some great posts and I do appreciate the recent one by omQ R. It was very poignent and objective.
harleyquinn
said,
2 months ago
I am going to deal with this one the same way I always deal with closed minded bigots. Yawn Britt, nothing to see here. The best way to deal with a bigot is just like a troll. Do not feed and do not take the bait.
believecommonsense
said,
2 months ago
fennec. thanks for the article, I hadn’t read it yet. I too like reading Brooks’ commentary.
winfield, I’ll just share that I refused to watch the movie about a fictional assassination attempt on Bush, even when it was shown on TV. I don’t find any entertainment or amusement about assassinations, having lived through too man y in my lifetime. I also think Beck should have been reprimanded for his sick joke about assassinating Pelosi via poison in her wine. Did you object to that?
wminfield
said,
2 months ago
BCS…I honestly didn’t hear Beck’s comment or hear about it. If he said it I don’t agree with it, but it is not mine or the publics job to handle HR issues for other companies (maybe he was reprimanded). I have worked in customer service and have had many situations where customers have demanded to know how I or my company handled a situation they didn’t like (it was none of their business).
I don’t pay that much attention to the screamers on either side of the aisle. Beck, Olberman, Maddow, Hannity, etc all sing the same tune over and over.
motivemagus said, 2 months ago
scott, you are totally incorrect, and the nature of your ignorance merely proves the point. Biologically, humans don’t have races. It’s a meaningless term. And Darwinist geneticists and biologists established that. So don’t try to draw the stupid link between Darwinism and Nazism, like Ben Stein did. It’s wrong, get it?
ChuckTrent64
said,
2 months ago
In fairness, there are those conservitives who oppose the presidnet on principal. But even they are racists if they don’t admit it. Racism comes wih what ever color skin you have.
scottfreitas
said,
2 months ago
Yeah Motive, just ignore all of History and present-day reality and claim no one thinks human beings have different races, or makes decisions based on that precept.
It’s so meaningless that every domestic policy the US government makes is first and foremost predicated on race. So meaningless that our entire society has been forcibly altered by the US government to make us more racially “diverse”. (as if each and every human being isn’t already an individual; nope, gotta go by skin color etc).
Darwinist biologists are the ones who during Darwin’s lifetime hunted down and murdered 1000s of Aborigines in Australia because they regarded them as being apes–missing links.
Hitler and his cronies quoted Darwinism at great length, using it as their inspiration for creating a Master Race etc
You can lie, lie, all you want, dude. You don’t fool me, you don’t fool God, I doubt you even fool your own cold, hard heart…
parkersinthehouse said, 2 months ago
hey scott
“These six things doth the LORD hate: yea, seven are an abomination unto him: A proud look, a lying tongue, and hands that shed innocent blood, An heart that deviseth wicked imaginations, feet that be swift in running to mischief, A false witness that speaketh lies, and he that soweth discord among brethren.” (Proverbs 6:16-19).
i can’t tell if you’re lying or just wrong-minded, but i do know that racist right leaning religious pundits sow discord among people.
4uk4ata said, 2 months ago
Well, in all honesty, there are left-wing pundits doing pretty much the same. I have to agree in this case, though - stirring the public with exaggerations and lies about death panels, spurious Nazi comparisons, etc, is wrong. It was wrong during the Bush years, too - although imo Bush was definitely closer, and got a much better end than he deserved, but that’s another story.
NoFearPup
said,
2 months ago
Libs suck. We all know it. And they know it, too. That’s why more than 63% of people polled said they were “conservative”, 25% or less said they were “liberal”. Lot of support there.
[Correction]
40% -Conservative - very conservative
35%-Moderate
21%-Liberal
http://www.gallup.com/poll/122333/Political-Ideology-Conservative-Label-Prevails-South.aspx#2
http://www.cnsnews.com/news/article/52602
M Kitt
said,
2 months ago
Whose study, PO? Write a study that differentiates between registered Dems/Repubs/Libertarians and then I’ll be impressed since poll numbers don’t support yours’ at all in terms of either voter turnout or party registration.
Doesn’t change the numbers PO. My comment was about elections (Pro-Dem) and registration numbers (Increasing Dems and Independants) contrary to your’ “Conservative” study.
The point being that surveys reflect what you want them to if worded properly :-)
motivemagus said, 2 months ago
scott, try to read, okay? I said biologically humans don’t have races. Of course I know that people think they exist, and idiots of all stripes are still trying to prove they do (e.g., The Bell Curve).
Darwin was against slavery, and this actually helped propel his theory of evolution.
He cannot be held responsible for those who misused, misunderstood, or simply screwed up his theory. “Social Darwinism” was an abomination that was utterly unsupported by Darwinist theory. And Hitler’s nonsense – unfortunately inspired by a number of American pseudoscientists – was not Darwinist, either.
I don’t accept your judgment on God’s feelings about me, either. You’re not entitled to offer any.
Considering that my “cold, hard heart” is apparently more empathic towards my fellow beings than yours (that’s what liberalism and feminism is all about, dude), I wonder what temperature yours is at? Liquid oxygen?
GNWachs
said,
2 months ago
I find it amusing to read the anguish, despair and utter helplessness of liberals trying to discredit The Bell Curve. Beautifully written, thoroughly researched and totally logical.
For those who haven’t actually read it, Herrnstein says there is a direct correlation between intelligence and success. Shock! How can that be?
That seems so obvious why do liberals oppose those conclusions? Because the people in this country who have achieved success have certain ethnic backgrounds that don’t coincide with PC views. If we accept the correlation that would imply differences between the races. And that would be depressing.
ahab
said,
2 months ago
GN, Bush sure busts up the Bell Curve theory.
ahab
said,
2 months ago
I guess he fits. He failed miserably.
ahab
said,
2 months ago
The dogmas of the quiet past are inadequate to the stormy present. The occasion is pile high with difficulty, and we must rise with the occasion. As our case is new, so we must think anew. We must disenthrall ourselves. LINCOLN
DrCanuck said, 2 months ago
GNWack-o says: “For those who haven’t actually read it, Herrnstein says there is a direct correlation between intelligence and success. Shock! How can that be?”
DrCanuck elaborates: Few would ever find a problem with that correlation. Unfortunately, that’s not all Murray and Herrnstein say. They then go on to find correlations between race and intelligence, which is where people have problems. And being “politically correct” has nothing to do with it.
Trust Wack-o to purposefully misrepresent an idea to push his agenda.
motivemagus said, 2 months ago
GNWachs, I’m an authority on assessment worldwide, with a Ph.D in personality psychology. I am not an amateur. The Bell Curve is both nonscientific (they didn’t dare go through peer review) and thoroughly political in nature, not “well-researched” and “totally logical.” Indeed you can accept all their points and still come up with a different logical conclusion.
Meta-analyses by respected researchers like Hunter & Schmidt indicate that IQ accounts for about 20-25% of variation in job success. Emotional Intelligence, by contrast, is closer to 45%. This is particularly true at senior levels in organizations. (I’ve spoken to Frank Schmidt myself, who agrees that at executive levels IQ probably quits differentiating between good and great performance - they’re already pretty smart [ about 115 IQ], but that isn’t enough, and you get restriction of range.)
The Bell Curve is indeed well written. It had to be. If you read carefully, you will find that their conclusions actually conflict with some of their data.
Furthermore, some of their research has in fact failed to deliver. For example, the twin studies some people love to point to are nowhere near as compelling as believed. It turns out that twins adopted by separate couples tend to be adopted by extraordinarily similar people which means the environmental factors are too.
Furthermore, geneticists will tell you (fennec? you’re a biologist) that races are pure fiction! The overlap between gene pools is overwhelming. (Especially in the US, incidentally, where most African-Americans of slave descent are about half European-American ancestry. Make of that what you will.)
Read a few of the scientists countering it, e.g., Stephen Jay Gould’s Mismeasure of Man, or The Bell Curve Debate (ed. Jacoby and Glauberman).
GNWachs
said,
2 months ago
To MM
Here’s that 5-page paper (by me) again now with page numbers as it was just published in the Proceedings of the Royal Society of London. It uses Jensen’s method of correlated vectors and finds that East Asian-European-South Asian-Colored-African differences on the Raven’s items are all more pronounced on the more heritable ones.
If the Royal Society says group differences are partly heritable, that’s as official as it gets in my book!
Best, Phil
Professor J. Philippe Rushton, Ph.D., D.Sc.
Department of Psychology,
University of Western Ontario,
London, Ontario, N6A 5C2, Canada
http://www.ssc.uwo.ca/psychology/faculty/rushton_bio.htm
Proc. R. Soc. B (2007) 274, 1773–1777
doi:10.1098/rspb.2007.0461
Published online 11 May 2007
GNWachs
said,
2 months ago
To MM
February–March 2005 ● American Psychologist 149
Copyright 2005 by the American Psychological Association 0003-066X/05/$12.00
Vol. 60, No. 2, 149–160 DOI: 10.1037/0003-066X.60.2.149
GNWachs
said,
2 months ago
To MM
Go to Linda’s vita–lots of great articles on race and IQ. She’s fearless.
From:”Linda Gottfredson”
Subject:Re: paper
To:
Dear Bob,
Thank you for sending your paper, as Ray suggested you might. If you are
able to download papers from the internet, you can get any of mine from my
e-vita. Some might be of interest for your present project.
http://www.udel.edu/educ/gottfredson/reprints/
motivemagus said, 2 months ago
Thanks for the references, GNW. I see Gottfredson’s an advocate for the “g” factor. I am not, as it happens; I’m firmly on the side of multiple intelligences based on my own work in business (which unfortunately precludes publishing much of it due to client restrictions). Much interesting recent neurobiological work appears to support my view, but it’s certainly not completely decided yet. I’ll take a look at her.
As for Rushton, but frankly he’s more than a little dubious as regards his research, even though his academic credentials are sterling. There’s quite a bit of discussion regarding his work in The Bell Curve Debate, including his “penis vs. brain” theory, which is more than a little strange, claiming that you can have one or the other but not both, and ordering Asians, Caucasians, and Africans along the axis from brain to penis. Even leaving out the Darwinian errors in this, as one researcher pointed out, a better measure of sexuality is probably the size of the scrotum, not the mere pipe of delivery. He’s also done some unapproved work (violating standard procedures for ethical standards) for which he was rightly disciplined by his university.
GNWachs
said,
2 months ago
To MM
When it comes to health care and medicine, Pharmacy, Big Pharma, pharmacology etc I have done the required study and spent the time. Obviously, your background and research lies in the fields above. I in no way able to debate your expertise in this field.
But one of my dearest friends is both a PhD in the field, a retired tenured professor from my alma mater the U of I and how he teaches at NYU.
The subject is of great interest to me and I wrote him about it last month. I sent his answers to you above. That is how I was able to reply so quickly. We have held many discussions on the subject. Literally Thursday night was the last. Humorously he described “liberal creationism”.
http://www.slate.com/id/2178122/entry/2178123/
That pretty much describes my personal views.
GNWachs
said,
2 months ago
All 4 articles together
http://www.slate.com/toolbar.aspx?action=print&id=2178122
churchillwasright said, 2 months ago
BCS: This is the Pelosi wine poisoning assassination remark that has your panties all twisted?
http://tinyurl.com/mxyavv
You’ve got to be kidding me, right? Do you get all your information from Media Matters?
(I will admit it’s a tough segway going from a scientific discussion of the bell curve to a 3 minute sophomoric skit)
believecommonsense
said,
2 months ago
^ if you want to rephrase your question without the condescending, sexist remark about twisted panties, I’ll respond.
churchillwasright said, 2 months ago
^ So “twisted panties” is now a sexist remark? You really need to lighten up.
How about shorts in a knot?
DrCanuck said, 2 months ago
And so, to summarize this huge amount of info on the Bell Curve:
There is no such thing as race, so after careful research and precise writing, Murray and Herrnstein have come to the conclusion that some people are more or less intelligent than others.
Yippee.
motivemagus said, 2 months ago
GNW - did you read all the way to the bottom, about Rushton’s associations? Anyone who funds an organization that starts with the assumption that blacks are “dangerous” and that white people need to protect their genes is likely to find that what they are looking for in their research…
I’m rushing out the door today so can’t dedicate the time this deserves (e.g., the work on brain size has traditionally been massively contaminated by body size and shape - but haven’t checked out this stuff), but there’s one massive, overwhelmingly important assumption that Rushton, et al., are making: That IQ measures intelligence, and secondarily that “intelligence” is a unitary thing (the latter is known as the g factor). This is by no means proven, though I know others will disagree with me on this; but recent neuropsychological studies and plenty of other kinds of research do suggest otherwise. If instead IQ measures a certain kind of paper-and-pencil (or web-based) problem-solving intelligence, then all their theories come tumbling down, and we replace it with a different approach, which is to identify which gene pools might have advantages in one category of intelligence over another. See, for example, Howard Gardners Frames of Mind for a very accessible description of multiple intelligences.
And I’ve found that analytical (cause-and-effect, chains of reasoning) thinking and conceptual (recognition of patterns, simplifying complex information) don’t correlate, and this is solid enough to separate the measures for managerial assessment!
GNWachs
said,
2 months ago
MM
If there is no such thing as “race” who exactly are the beneficiaries of Affirmative Action? When one competes the college application that box must be checked off. This is an example of when it helps liberals there is such a thing as race.
If there is no such thing as “race” who exactly is the Justice Department protecting when they don’t allow cities and states to change district boundary lines before elections. It might harm some (group?) Another example of if it helps liberals than there is such a thing as race.
If there is no such thing as race who are the beneficiaries of laws designed to stop DWB. Driving while black in which state police stop some groups more than others. Another example of if it helps liberals there is such a thing as race.
AAMOF, the only time there is no such thing as race is when it comes to IQ tests, then the concept of race doesn’t exist.
Naturally liberals don’t believe in g. Because if there was such a thing everything we call discriminatory would fall neatly into place. It would solve the hundreds of impossible to answer questions about difference in success rates. We could forget about AA and instead concentrate on education.
We say we believe in evolution and therefore different homo sapiens evolved differently. Pygmies, giants, black skin, white skin, redskin etc etc. the only place there was no evolution is in general intelligence.
believecommonsense
said,
2 months ago
church, I’ve described Beck’s performance re Pelosi as a sick joke and I fully condemn it. I don’t think making jokes about assassinating anyone is funny, nor appropriate and I condemn it. The position of speaker of the house is third in line for the presidency. I don’t give a durn what you think of the person who currently holds the office, assassination jokes are appalling.
Sophomoric is too kind, Beck is deranged but he sure is having fun and making money.
wminfield and I had a dialogue elsewhere on this site and I told him I equally condemn the movie made about a fictional assassination of Bush. I condemn all assassination jokes. Period.
And I’ve heard of media matters, of course, but don’t go to the site. I’ve stated repeatedly I like getting “news” and “facts.” Unlike you, I don’t seek sources that will conform to my preconceived and uninformed notions.